Questions about malocclusion

Susan · May 11, 2015

Hi Alpayton and Chin Experts,

I found Alpayton's post about Chin's malocclusion and think you are very knowledgeable and experienced on malocclusion issues. I am glad I am able to post question here, and would hope to get some advice.

I was told by my vet my chin has malocclusion by gene. She has received dental work twice at interval of 3.5 months. My vet gave negative prediction to her situation and said a Chin like her usually wouldn't live a long life. I was sad but I want to try my best to let her live longer and happier. At the moment my chin girl only has overgrow and spurs and can be fixed via dental work. My questions are:

1. Can I know what the average life span is for Chin with malocclusion by gene and what is the longest life span could it be?
2. I saw your post said "long term poor prognosis", does it mean no matter what we do, chin would finally grow to worst situation and lead to death? Or is that situation avoidable？ What are the things I can do to prevent this situation? (beside dental work and periodically exam)
3. What are the worst situations that would lead to death, besides root elongation?
4. If I make sure my chin has enough of calcium, can root elongation be avoidable all her life?
5. If there is other worst situation, how can I avoid it.
6. Shall I give 0 treats to my chin? Or can I give a little bit of dry apply?
7. My chin hates to eat hay, I understand partly it is caused by malocclusion, but I know she can eat more she just doesn't like it she likes mazuri pellet too much. My question is shall I try hard to make her eat more or just live with it? I know what people do is give the chin hay only for a few days until she eat at least 10g/per day of hay, then gradually give some pellet, but with no more than 13g of pellet. Because when she get more pellet, the chin will refuse to eat hay again. I am not sure if should do something like that to make my chin eat more but on the other hand I am worried if she eat only 13g of pellet if she would gain enough nutrition and lead to root elongation. I want to know how I shall balance between eating more hay and giving her enough nutrition.
8. When the worse situation happen, what about the option of removing all the problem teeth and feed her with Oxbow critical care? Currently I mix it with some water and give her everyday a bit as treats. She loves it. Is it possible to keep her life by feeding her with moist or liquefied Oxbow critical care ?

Thanks so much for your time and help!
Susan

ticklechin · May 11, 2015

1. Can I know what the average life span is for Chin with malocclusion by gene and what is the longest life span could it be?

Lifespan is not important when it comes to malo chins, quality of life is the most important thing. With loads of time and money, they can be kept alive for the owners selfish purposes, but should they is the question.

2. I saw your post said "long term poor prognosis", does it mean no matter what we do, chin would finally grow to worst situation and lead to death? Or is that situation avoidable？ What are the things I can do to prevent this situation? (beside dental work and periodically exam)

I have had 10 malo chins, I have done all but one form of treatment avaliable at the time, spent well over 15,000.00 keeping them alive because I have the knowledge and money to do so, all of them either died or were put down when even I could not put them through the treatment anymore. They will suffer and die, there is no way around it.

3. What are the worst situations that would lead to death, besides root elongation?

Malo chins are under a huge amount of stress, this leads to a weakened immune system, they are prone to infections-upper respiratory and bone infections are most common.

4. If I make sur e my chin has enough of calcium, can root elongation be avoidable all her life?

No, calcium has nothing to do with elongation. Elongation happens when the crowns of the teeth overgrow due to the chin not eating enough roughage-whether its because they can't eat or are eating a improper diet. When the mouth closes and there is no slack, the teeth are signaled to reverse direction growing into the eye socket or out the lower jaw bone.

5. If there is other worst situation, how can I avoid it.

There is no avoiding the death of the chin.

6. Shall I give 0 treats to my chin? Or can I give a little bit of dry apply?

Giving a malo chin treats can only lead to more issues-especially with the gut.

7. My chin hates to eat hay, I understand partly it is caused by malocclusion, but I know she can eat more she just doesn't like it she likes mazuri pellet too much. My question is shall I try hard to make her eat more or just live with it? I know what people do is give the chin hay only for a few days until she eat at least 10g/per day of hay, then gradually give some pellet, but with no more than 13g of pellet. Because when she get more pellet, the chin will refuse to eat hay again. I am not sure if should do something like that to make my chin eat more but on the other hand I am worried if she eat only 13g of pellet if she would gain enough nutrition and lead to root elongation. I want to know how I shall balance between eating more hay and giving her enough nutrition.

If this chin truely has malo, pellets and hay will not be eaten as the condition progresses.

8. When the worse situation happen, what about the option of removing all the problem teeth and feed her with Oxbow critical care? Currently I mix it with some water and give her everyday a bit as treats. She loves it. Is it possible to keep her life by feeding her with moist or liquefied Oxbow critical care ?

Unless all the teeth are removed, selectively removing teeth worsens the situation, I know it for a fact. The spaces that are left by the removed teeth are filled in by the other teeth since chin teeth are not anchored in bone, they will drift front and back, in and out and upward and downward.

All dental chins should be fed critical care as the main ration, leaving pellets and hay as treats-malo chins do not eat enough on their own to stay alive long term.

ticklechin · May 11, 2015

One thought I want to leave this thread with, in the early stages of malocclusion the chinchilla, besides not eating will be the same ole chinchilla you know, and its hard to think that it won't get better. The thing you have to understand is this, the chin is suffering. You don't want the chin to suffer, you won't want to witness the suffering, and you especially won't want to be the cause of the suffering. The unavoidable decision will weigh heavily and constantly. You will truly be playing God, deciding on life or death. I now opt to put them down when they still have their personality. When the chin is still a chin, doing chin things. Putting off a decision is understandable but is often not in the best interests of the chinchilla and can result in feelings of regret and guilt, I have had both and it hurts deeply.

Susan · May 13, 2015

Thanks a lot Ticklechin for the clear reply. It is sad to hear about that. I would still like to know about life span so that I am prepared for that in heart.

I totally agree that to do in the best interests of the chinchilla not for self. At the moment I think my chin is still fine. She loves eating Mazuri she can eat a lot. And her weigh is stable. She looks happy and bounds against the wall every day and loves exploring. Once I find abnormal situation (stop eating hay, eating like using more with incisor...)I bring her to vet for check and dental work. My understanding of your advice of putting her down is for the final stage I guess, when she couldn't eat and no treatment can fix any more. My vet indeed told me a final solution for a final stage that chin maybe living with all the teeth removed and feed with oxbow critical care. I am not sure it that would be terrible life or acceptable life for a chin. I usually think aninimal has strong will to live even in a bad condition... But I agree if living is painful, I should let go.

Regarding root elongation and calcium, I see this in Alpayton's post with title "malocclusion": " Malocclusion is not always a "death sentence," it may be reversible in the initial and mid stages with intensive calcium supplementing among other things, see Supplementing Calcium and Implementing Environmental Changes." It gave me some hope... but probablly it doesn't apply to my chin case?

ticklechin · May 14, 2015

I am sad to say that the calcium supplement was a internet rumor put out there by a "rescue" group years ago, when they were pushed to prove the point, they disappeared into the sunset, they had no proof and could not provide proof-its sad when they did it for their own self importance and gave malo chin parents false hope. Chin teeth are not anchored in bone like human and other animal teeth, so calcium supplementation does squat, and actually by adding calcium and upsetting the calcium phosphorus balance the body will actually excrete calcium leaving a depletion. The only anecdotal evidence of something that MIGHT slow down elongation is Vit C supplementation, this will help build up the connective tissue that holds the teeth in place theoretically, this is not based on facts or science, but when given Vit C in large doses there seems to be a slow down, I did experience this as did other chin parents in a control group. This thought led to some minor research that led no where, it was thought that elongation was a form of scurvy. If your chin can still eat, I would no nothing at this point.

ticklechin · May 14, 2015

Here is a interesting study done in Poland in 2009, showing excess calcium actually can cause malo due to the over mineralising of the tooth enamel making it harder for the chin to grind down, makes sense. So excess calcium and decreased chewing from domestic diets that supplement calcium can be one cause.

http://www.isez.pan.krakow.pl/journals/folia/pdf/58(1-2)/58(1-2)_17.pdf

Idgie · May 15, 2015

Many years ago before forums like this (some of us remember life before the internet lol), I had a chin that was starting to have problems eating pellets. Only having a book from a pet store and a vet that did not know as much about chins as she professed, I thought that I was being helpful by grinding his pellets up so that he could eat. Little did I know, he had a tooth growing into his jaw and was in pain. As soon as I understood this, I put him down. But I still have guilt over not doing it sooner and letting him suffer. I would never have let it go that far had I known. And now I know.