I don't know what to do

[caiti]

I noticed my chin Chloe hasn't eaten in the past day or so and she hasn't pooped either. So I tried to feed her some CC and I just couldn't. The syringe kept sticking and I couldn't keep her still in the burrito. When it was over ahe maybe ate 10mL at the most and she was covered in CC. I was covered in CC, fur and some blood from where she bit me. I tried to get the CC off with a paper towel with warm water and then gave her a dust bath and it now just looks like it's gonna matt up.

I tried to get a picture of her fur but of course my camera broke right before I pushed the button to take the picture. If she won't eat and I can't force feed her I don't know what to do. I didn't want to put this in emergencies because she's not dying but this will become an emergency if I can't figure out how to get her to eat.

I have a 35 mL syringe and a few single mL syringes. I might try to add some Lifeline or Dyne to the CC and see if she will eat that without me having to burrito her. But, her fur I don't know what to do with.

 

[alli713]

I can't help you with the not eating in general, but some chins enjoy eating the CC off of a spoon, or if you leave it in a dish in their cage. I imagine being wrapped and force-fed is rather traumatic if they're not used to it.

 

[Sandi]

Do you have any baby gas drops (simethicone)? Give her at least 0.3 ml and gently rub her tummy and give her a bit of run time in the bathroom. If it's the plain flavored CC you might want to add a small amount of blackstrap molasses or canned pure pumpkin not the filling kind. See if she'll lick some of that lifeline mixed with water. Has she drank any water? You may need to get her to a vet if she continues and you don't get anything in her. Good luck. Also, she has to be almost dry before going into the dust. But right now the important thing is to get her gut moving.

 

[fanofdmb84]

I actually dump a bunch of shredded wheat bites into the bag of CC and then hand them out daily. They only get a little bit of CC but at least they are getting used to the smell and taste. I also mixed a little bit of CC with some of the alfalfa leaves from the bottom of the bag of hay and made tiny little cookies out of the mixture, let them sit out to dry, and handed them out as treats. Maybe you could try making it more treat-like to see if you can get her to eat something that way.

 

[Laurie]

Her fur is the last thing to worry about now. If she isn't eating and isn't pooing that is a trip to the vet for sure. Now that you've gotten her to eat something, definitely allow her out for playtime and see if she does poo. If you notice her stretching or rubbing her belly against the cage floor this is a sign of bloat where you'll need to get simethicone needs to come into play.

Even though you say you can't force feed her you really must try. It is not good for her at all not to have eaten for 2 or more days.

Let her out for some play time, massage her belly and see if you can get poos--if not get her to the vet in morning.

 

[caiti]

Thank you everyone for replying. I actually offered her some CC on a spoon and in a bowl yesterday because I noticed there wasn't as much poo in her cage as usual and I had vacuumed the day before. She wouldn't touch it. I have the apple banana flavored CC but not the regular kind.

I just got her to eat about 10 mL of lifeline, she likes it. I did not burrito her to feed her the lifeline. I noticed a few small poos after she ate. I have seen her srink a couple times today but a little less than usual, I made the lifeline kind of watery so she could get some fluids in her. She's peed a couple times since I started feeding her actually. Will the mixed up Lifeline and CC be ok in the fridge for 24 hours? I think I read that somewhere. I am going to get a coffee grinder, some black strap molasses and simethicone tomorrow morning. I actually wanted to get some simethicome when I went grocery shopping a few days ago just so I would have it but I forgot to get it go figure.

I tried to massage her belly all day but she keeps running away. She was running around her cage and in her wheel when was feeding her, but I think I will let her out for a run around the room right now. She hasn't been doing the bloat stretching that I've seen. You're right, I know I have to force feed her. It was very difficult tonight but I will try as many times as I have to if there is no alternative.

 

[aznmexaggie]

Do you have a 10 mL syringe? I don't like to use the 35 mL syringes on chins who aren't used to taking CC and having that big syringe tip in their mouth.

 

[caiti]

No I only have 35 mL and 1 mL, but am going to stop by my vets to see if I can get syringes from them tomorrow when I go to get the other stuff. I actually fed her the lifeline with the 1 mLs, she took it readily. It was a little annoying to have to fill it up every 30 seconds but I can live with that.

I just let her out for about 45 minutes. I did see one small poo but to be honest when I started watching her run around my room I realized there are probably stray poos near her cage that the vaccuum missed but I know at least one was from the past hour.

I am still very worried and anxious but it's after 2am and I need to get to sleep if I want to get to the store early. I think Chloe and I are probably equally exhausted.

 

[ticklechin]

Petsmart sells the 10ml syringes in the bird health department in case your vet does not have them.

 

[Claire D]

I have been looking back at some of your other posts about Chloe & I am a little concerned that she does not seem to have been on a stable diet - it looks like you've been changing feed & stuff with her - she had soft droppings back in June, you've changed food more than once, she's been losing weight & in one thread (here) you state that you are going to "change her food as often as I can to encourage her".

Please can you post for us exactly what you have been feeding Chloe over the last few months since you got her, specifically the pellets & hay. Also list any treats she has.

 

[mishellyshel]

ditto on the 10 ml syringes. i get mine at walmart. even my chin who has been hanfed for over a year doesnt like the 35 ccs. it just too big and it will get messy because it is difficult to hold a squirmy chin and try to press this huge thing.

you do need to get the gut moving with critical care or something. gas drops are good becuse the food intake is inconsitant as well as they often ingest air during the handfeeding process. and i love lifeline! good stuff.

in addition, if you are switching around her feed and stressing her a bit with this force feeding she isnt going to poop consistantly. keep her routine consistant and try to take her out for more "playtime" to get that gut moving. i usually do lifeline, gas drops, than feed mix. Currently i am using the Essential for Life from www.fuzzieskingdom.com and my one chin LOVES it. he will not touch critcal care. and he usually gets pellets ground up mixed with a little baby food squash but he has been really doing well on the EFL, so he has been getting that straight. i highly recommend it.

 

[caiti]

Claire--thank you for your concern. As a new chin owner I am never really confident as to what is an issue or not. And knowing they are vulnerable creatures, I worry and have posted about every concern I've had for her.

*I got her 2/28/10--she was on Kaytee food and I switched her to Mazuri. She had some petstore timmy hay and when I ran out of that small bag I got Oxbow timmy. I threw away those yogurt drops I got with her and have only given her safe treats ever since.
*On 6/3/10- she went to the vet for soft poo, negative giardia test and got antibiotics. Her poos are normal now, or were before this current fiasco, although I got really worried every time her poo changed slightly but there wasn't anything else that made me think she was sick. I had thought I just needed to get my bearings and realize what's normal for her and that every poo does not have to be an exact replica of all the others.
*On 6/14/10 I switched her feed to PRCS (the PANR replacement I found out)

What I meant in my thread by saying I was going to change her food to encourage her to eat was that I was going to give her fresh food from the bag and change out her bowl more than once a day. I did not mean change brands. I've changed her feed twice since I've got her but I can see how that sentence could have been misinterpretted.

She eats crushed rosehips, an occasional shreddie, gogi berry (I think she's had 4 in her life), occasional oats , once on a while a QMC cookie, rosebud and I recently bought some Sweet Meadow alfalfa hay and give her a few strands maybe once a day. A couple times I've mixed a little in with her timmy hay in her hay box. I was worried her teeth were not as orange as they should be. They seem to actually look a little more orangey now even though it's only been a week or so since I bought it. Other than that she gets lots of chewies (KD pine, polar, pumice, twigs--mosty apple, other wood that I bought in a pack from QMC, cardboard bagel thing, loofah and that's all I can think of at the moment).

She began losing weight before I switched her to PRCS actually. She now pretty much stays at 560 but knowing she's been 600+ worries me. She feels ok--definitely better than when I first got her but I think I would feel more comfortable if she gained some.

I woke up this morning and noticed some small poos in her cage. I gathered them up and counted 26 poos but most are very tiny. I have not gone to the store yet because I also woke up being violently ill. Unfortunately I am having some medicinal issues that are making me sick but it comes in waves so I am going to the store in the next hour since I don't think I'll be sick in the store.

My concern is should I see if she improves with hand feeding and simethicone today or just call the vet now? Also, I think I remember reading it's ok, but if a chin doesn't have bloat will giving them simethicone be detrimental?

 

[caiti]

ditto on the 10 ml syringes. i get mine at walmart. even my chin who has been hanfed for over a year doesnt like the 35 ccs. it just too big and it will get messy because it is difficult to hold a squirmy chin and try to press this huge thing.

he will not touch critcal care. and he usually gets pellets ground up mixed with a little baby food squash but he has been really doing well on the EFL, so he has been getting that straight. i highly recommend it.

Thank you for your advice. I actually only had a little bit of lifeline so I'm out but I am going to grind her pellets and maybe add a tiny bit of apple juice or dyne, maybe even just to the tip if she won't go for it. And hopefully I can get more lifeline soon. I will write up a rountine for her feeding and try to keep it consistent. I hate that 35mL syringe as well. There's a grocery store across the street and my vet is about a block away but Petco is a little farther so hopefully my vet has some better sized syringes. Well, I'm off to the store now.

Thank you everyone for replying so fast.

 

[caiti]

Ok, I'm back. I got a coffee grinder, baby 20 mg simethicone, various syringes from 6mL-12mL and molasses. I could not find blackstrap molasses. The kind I bought is called Brer Rabbit It's unsulphured, gluten free. Per 1 tbsp/15mL it has:

60 cals
0 fat
25 mg sodium
210 mg potassium
15 g carbs
12 g sugar
0 protein

I am not sure whether that is safe to use or not. It seems to have a lot of carbs and sugar compared to blackstrap but the other kind in the store had more (there were only two kinds). If it's not safe I'll just go find blackstrap somewhere.

She is still chewing. She's working on a bagel thing and I see that she destoyed most of it last night.

I gave her a gogi berry yesterday, a shreddie, a loofah and a couple small pieces of rosehip. Before that she didn't really get anything in the way of treats, I was trying to coax her to eat yesterday I don't usually give her that much and that variety of things. I think I gave her another shreddie about 3 or more days ago. She's had a bit of alfalfa the past week. I realized I never posted what she's eaten in the past few days.

 

[mishellyshel]

personally i would skip the blakstrap and add a little of baby food squash or canned pumpkin, not the pie kind. i use the squash, stage 1, because they are in small containers. i only add it because when you add filtered water to the ground up pellets it is kinda thick. in the beginning i actually mixed up a little critical care with the pellets and some baby food. you really only use a little babyfood. start with 1/2 of the stage 1 small container to about 1 -2 days worth of mix. if only eating mix and not eating pellets, your chin should eat 60 - 120 cc's of mix per day, spread out between 3 - 4 feedings.

i used to do 40 ccs am, afternonoon & pm. in the begining i would have to tightly buritto and i fought with richie, it was a pita! now he sits on my lap, no towel, and just eats his mix. only about 30ish cc's per night and i consider it maintenance. but he is on daily meds & has malo so i feel it is necessary.

your goal will be to wean your chin off this and get her eating her pellets again.

 

[Claire D]

Claire--thank you for your concern. As a new chin owner I am never really confident as to what is an issue or not. And knowing they are vulnerable creatures, I worry and have posted about every concern I've had for her.

*I got her 2/28/10--she was on Kaytee food and I switched her to Mazuri. She had some petstore timmy hay and when I ran out of that small bag I got Oxbow timmy. I threw away those yogurt drops I got with her and have only given her safe treats ever since.
*On 6/3/10- she went to the vet for soft poo, negative giardia test and got antibiotics. Her poos are normal now, or were before this current fiasco, although I got really worried every time her poo changed slightly but there wasn't anything else that made me think she was sick. I had thought I just needed to get my bearings and realize what's normal for her and that every poo does not have to be an exact replica of all the others.
*On 6/14/10 I switched her feed to PRCS (the PANR replacement I found out)

What I meant in my thread by saying I was going to change her food to encourage her to eat was that I was going to give her fresh food from the bag and change out her bowl more than once a day. I did not mean change brands. I've changed her feed twice since I've got her but I can see how that sentence could have been misinterpretted.

Thank you for the clarification - so she's had 3 brands of food in 4 months & some digestive problems along the way. That gives us clear, concise background info to work from.

Sorry - a few more questions:
How much hay does she normally eat & how much pellets?
When was the last time you saw her eating properly?
Is she lethargic, stretching out or showing other signs of discomfort?
Does her belly feel bloated or tight?
Is she attempting to eat or drink herself at all?

 

[Olallie]

I wouldnt mix any treats in her bowl or in the cage, as she will pick out the treats and not eat the pellets. Have you listened to her belly yet? If there are popping sounds there you 'll have to give her more simethecone. If you hear nothing, go to the vet. And if you hear quiet gurgling sounds then she is alright, but i wouldnt stop the simethecone until she poos normally.

 

[caiti]

Claire-she usually eats a handful of hay and about 2 tbsps of pellets a day. I honestly don't remember the last time I saw her eat, I just remember not seeing her eat yesterday at all. The day before, if I saw her eat I probably wouldn't have made a memory of it. But I did notice she didn't poo as often on tuesday.

Her belly does not feel bloated at all. And Ollalie--I honestly couldn't hear much except her heartbeat. I did hear a couple gurgling sounds but mostly I just got kicked in the face so I couldn't be sure. I gave her a dose of simethicone around 1pm. And I haven't been giving her any treats in her food bowl and none at all since yesterday afternoon.

When I let her out she still darts around and runs really fast, that seems the same and all. She is not stretching or lethargic. I just gave her 6 mLs of lifeline and she's pooped a few times since that. Her poos look almost normal but there's only about 5 in the cage since I changed it a couple hours ago. Oh, ok I just looked up and see her sitting next to like 5 poos...and now she's eating a new one. Lovely. Ok, now there's at least 10 poos under her. They are not as big as normal but at least double or triple the size they were last night. Not squishy or wet, just smaller versions of her normal poos.

I see her drink from her bottle still. A couple times today and a few times yesterday. I see her peeing definitely no less than she normally had. I have seen her munching on a strand or two of hay and last night she ran up to her bowl, stopped and then kind of ran back on her wheel.

 

[momenteller]

I have had days when my girls have eaten less than usual and had smaller poos or pooed less than usual, but I've never force-fed them. Am I missing something here? :hmm:

 

[caiti]

I have had days when my girls have eaten less than usual and had smaller poos or pooed less than usual, but I've never force-fed them. Am I missing something here? :hmm:

On tuesday I noticed she was pooing less and her food bowl didn't look like it had changed much. I watched her all yesterday and she ate nothing and she didn't poo. So late last night I decided to force feed her. I thought chins are really supposed to keep their GI tract going. She's never not pooed for a whole day. Or not eaten anything for a whole day. Last night her poos were very very tiny when she finally did poo after or around midnight. I did try to see if she would eat any CC by itself but she wouldn't. She will eat about a mL of lifeline by herself if I smear a raisen on the syringe tip but that's it. So I decided to force feed her. Maybe I'm wrong but I have a feeling she wouldn't have started eating anything on her own and it would have gotten worse. She still isn't eating pellets though I've been trying to get her to but I know me force feeding her has probably put off her appetite. I got one or two more mLs of lifeline in her just now without burritoing her. I'm almost out so I will try to see if she likes the ground up pellets better.