Herbs vs Dried Veggies - Food for thought?

[Tagna]

There is itchy stuff in the whole rosehips. I have heard on here that is how they make itching powder. That stuff is brutal if you touch it.

 

[ticklechin]

Mine hate rose hips of any way shape or form.

 

[tunes]

I never thought twice about buying the herb supplements. That is because they were from suppliers that were approved on this forum. Plus, there were some ads in the "supplies for sale" section. I thought if they weren't 100% safe, the forum would not allow them to be posted.

Bad sellers are not allowed to sell. If you CHOOSE to buy supplies from someone, that's not our business. I can tell you (the collective you, not you, you) until you're blue in the face not to buy from someone, but you're going to continue to do so if you like what you buy.

Read what I say darn near every time someone asks about treats. I say K.I.S.S. Keep It Simple Stupid. Pellets, hay/hay cubes, water, wood chews. If me saying it over and over again isn't enough to deter you from trying 20 different supplements, then what is?

 

[starleomach]

I don't touch the herb suppliments. Not worth the Risk I am with Peggy here. Pellets, Hay/cubes, water and wood. I do have lifeline and critical care on hand for issues and ryerson suppliment as well if someone seems off I give them a bit to determine interest. The less in their diet the less can go wrong

 

[mishellyshel]

Kristy reminded me of something that I meant to mention in my other post.......I love the product lifeline and use it daily on a select chin or two, I also know it is recommended and used by many many members.....but if you read the ingredients they are derived of many herb and also fruit proteins. Some of which I personally use in my blend. And herbs they I have seen in other supplements.
So why is it that someone like myself who uses researched herbs is perhaps viewed as being "careless" or "risk taking" but lifeline is recommend and used by many of the same people who say the only use pellet, hay, & water.
And no one has ever said those words to me, which is why I said "perhaps" I am just playing devils advocate and saying "what if".

 

[Essentia]

I also have to admit I am a bit confused by many people in this thread's take on herbs, especially since many feed lifeline. Tanya's syringe feed has come highly recommended from at least one admin of this site, and it is ALL herbs (other than the timothy and alfalfa hay, just like my flower salad).

Ingredients and Nutritional Analysis: Premium timothy, organic alfalfa, organic dandelion leaf and root, organic nettle leaf, organic rosehips, organic oats and oat bran, organic wheat bran, organic lemon balm, organic chamomile flowers, organic calendula flowers, organic oat straw, organic catnip, organic yellow duck root, organic licorice root, organic hibiscus flowers, organic slippery elm inner bark, organic Andean yacon root (natural source of prebiotics).

I also highly recommend her syringe feed. Chins love it and they maintain their weight better than on Critical Care. I know several of us here have used Tanya's immunity booster herbs and that helped immensely with healing chins that antibiotics alone were not working on. Why the change of heart?

I also have to agree with Michelle on Lifeline.

Alfalfa, Bee Pollen, Whole Wheat, Oat, & Rice, Peppermint, Oregano, 8 Billion Probiotic/6 Strains: *Lactobacillus acidophilus, *Bifidobacterium lactis (bifidum), *Bifidobacterium longum, *Lactobacillus paracaseil sub-sp., *Streptococcus thermophilus, *Lactobacillus bulgaricus 10 Sources of Digestive Enzymes: *Papaya Fruit Powder, *Pineapple Juice Powder, *Betaine (from Beets & Molasses), *Papain (from Papaya), *Protease, *Amylase, *Lipase, *Cellulase, *Lactase, *Bromelain (from Pineapple), VitaminC:*Ester-C Ascorbate, *Citrus Bioflavonoids, *Acerola, *Rutin, Rose Hips, Honey, Yucca Schidigera, Electrolyte

A large amount of the ingredients are also herbs.


When it comes to my salad (just because it was mentioned already), I specifically use herbs that are well known and safe. I do not willy nilly play with different herbs. I have used the same recipe for a few years and don't have plans on changing it, because it works for me, and others. It's helped chins eat hay who wouldn't previously (several members mix it with their hay), didn't want anything to do with food after hand feeding (can speak for several chins here that it helped get them to eat solids again when they wouldn't touch the pellets), and with chins who just weren't eating enough (think Tia). I don't try to push my salad on anyone though. I feed it because I have had very good results. For the same reason many people here use Lineline or Tany's syringe feed.

As for vegetables, I do not feed them, nor do I plan to.

 

[mishalaa]

I never have and most likely never will use lifeline. I am not convinced it has benefits that simpler remedies cannot solve.

 

[RDZCRanch]

I've only used lifeline for a select few very ill chinchillas. I've never used it as a regular supplement for my animals or even given it to my babies. Honestly, I talked to ranchers and started mixing my own hand feeding supplements of ground hay, oats, pellets and other things they should normally eat. I don't even keep lifeline on hand. I also have never bought anything from Tanya's site.

I don't think anyone in this thread is attacking particular vendors or anyone using herbs. I've seen a lot of people telling the newer members to do their research before buying from any source. To assume someone new to this site knows Crysta or Tanya from seller X, Y, or Z that sell unsafe treats and herbs would, frankly, be dumb. The simple fact of the matter is that herbs have only been around and used for a relatively short amount of time in the chinchilla community. Heck, when I started probably the only dried herb anyone would say was ok for a chinchilla to consume was mint, and lifeline hadn't even been introduced to the chinchilla community.

Pet chinchillas are becoming more and more popular, VERY quickly. Because of this you have a lot of new owners asking for more and more and more safe treats and "fun" things to give their pets. I've watched the forums the past 8 years I've been around and I just keep seeing more and more things thrown into the classifieds that are "safe" with no testing and no solid evidence IN CHINCHILLAS to back it up. We won't know the effects of the different herbs on chinchillas for possibly 10-15 years. Why let your animals be the lab rats?

 

[Spoof]

I also try to keep my diet as unexciting and stable as possible.

Which is interesting because chinchillas are built to be equal opportunity devourers - tests have shown they consume hundreds of different plants but very few berries or seeds. So they consume a lot of woody herbal material and little fat/protein. I also suspect they eat whatever insects they run across as well. I know mine do.

We won't know the effects of the different herbs on chinchillas for possibly 10-15 years. Why let your animals be the lab rats?

Some of it has been around and been fed for decades. Feed recipes have always been closely guarded and can make or break a herd. I've been told by every rancher I've asked that the pellet is just hay - it's the vitamin supplement you add to the pellet process that makes a good feed.

 

[ticklechin]

LL has been around for what 7 or 8 years? Its not a fad and I know Dawnna gave it to her own herd and select friends herds for years before she offered it. Its not a fad food, IMO.

 

[tunes]

Crysta - I agree with Tab. Being a well established seller is one thing. But every time you turn around someone is coming up with a new miracle herb supplement, and it scares me that people flock to buy it. I don't know jack about herbs, so I don't trust using them with my herd.

And, BTW, an "admin" on this site doesn't recommend anything. I do. I am a person, who happens to be an admin. Admin is my job here, it's not my life. Throwing admin behind it makes it sound like some all powerful person is recommending something, when it's just me and my own personal experiences.

 

[Essentia]

I understand that Peggy. I didn't want to specifically speak for you, hence the reason I didn't say your name.

 

[Tagna]

Just out of curiousity, does anyone know of a good course in herbs with regards to giving it to animals? I found this one:

http://www.civtedu.org/

I think it really is interesting to learn about herbs, I'm just curious what is out there for me and anyone else that wants to learn.

 

[Megan]

I've used lifeline once on a shocky, attacked chin. It didn't do anything different for him then when I treated previous shocky/attacked chins without it.

Haven't used it since, and infact I threw it out as it was here for years in the back of the chin closet.

So nope I don't even use life line... I'll use CC if they really need it. A lot of the times if someone is off feed i'll just grind pellets and give them that.

 

[Sandi]

I use Tanya's broad spectrum supplement as a treat for the chins. I agree that new people come on board and see others selling products and want to do the same but most likely do not do a lot of research behind it. It's almost like, well I've got that so I might as well sell that too, but can't back it up when questioned. I believe in Tanya's products, I know she has done a lot of research and lab work. I as well talked to a few long time breeders and owners and tried to research as much as I could. I truly want only the best for my pets, whether it's chinchillas, dogs, etc. I've also looked at quite a few websites of very respected owners/breeders and a few sell herb/oat supplements with one saying that it has worked well for over 18 years.

 

[Claire D]

I love forums. :thumbsup:
Sometimes you start a thread expecting it to go in one direction & instead it meanders all over the place ............ this is one of them ........ interesting but not quite answering the original questions.

Please can we address the initial questions rather than critiquing people's products?

My question then, is quite simple:
What is the difference between feeding dried herbs to chins & feeding dried veggies?

My next question is:
Why do people feel it is ok to feed dried herbs but not dried veggies?

 

[Tagna]

I think people think herbs are safe (over dried veggies) is because they hear that the herbs are safe and natural.

I personally feel herbs are way more dangerous than dried veggies as with herbs there is so much unknown with their use with animals. I think people become lax as some herbs are thought to be safe and mild.

As well, it's usually said right off the bat when you get to this forum, no fruits or vegs. Herbs are a tricky thing, some might be fine, others not. People google the name of a herb and read it's fine and think nothing more of it.

 

[Sycamore Chins]

I don't think it's good idea to feed either herbs or dried veggies.

I follow the KISS rule - Keep It Simple, Stupid.

IMO - why risk it? Why give your chins these random items? To make yourself feel better, that you're "livening up their lives" or "giving them a variety to choose from"?
This goes along with the whole "people food" thing for your dogs and cats. The only time my animals get people food is if it falls to the ground and i'm not quick enough to say no or scoop it up.

I agree that this is likely what causes pet animals to not make it to ripe old ages.

We give pellets, hay, water, and the occasional oat, wheat, flax seed supplement and shredded wheat. They get boring old pine or apple wood chew toys. It's blah, it's bland, but our chins are thriving with most of them being 8-10 years old and still producing. None of them are fur chewing or fighting or just fading away because they're oh so bored with their dreary lives.

 

[Ash]

I think (and I may be completely off base in this) that people feel it is ok to feed herbs because they don't seem that different from hay.. as in, they are dried plant material. I don't give much aside from the odd cheerio or piece of shredded wheat. Other than that? Hay, pellets, and wood...

 

[menagerie]

I think (and I may be completely off base in this) that people feel it is ok to feed herbs because they don't seem that different from hay.. as in, they are dried plant material.

So are fruits and vegetables.