Help! Chin stopped eating

[ysy]

Hi everyone,

I need some advice. Here is what happened. This morning, I noticed my chin Kelly sleeping in her pee pan. Now she never sleeps in her pee pan and I thought it weird. Weirder still is that she didn't get up to greet me because usually the first time I do is to feed them and they are all kind of used to the routine. Okay, I woke up earlier today 6am because I had work (and the last 2 weekends, I overslept and fed them around 10am). So I gathered that she's probably still sleepy. The other 2 chins were up and excited though.

I called her name and she would lift her head, look at me and go back to sleep again. When I opened her door, she jumped right up and wanted out of the cage, climbed all over me, etc. I gave her her dust bath (which is her routine too), cleaned up her cage - usual amount of poo, she ate a lot the previous night, filled up her bowl (It was empty, she always empties her bowl) She ignored her food (unusual) and went back to sleep, ignoring me even when I call her name, unless of course I open the door.

Feeling that she was a little out of sorts, and a huge public holiday is coming up (all vets will be closed for a week), I thought i'll just pop her over to her regular vet for a check. Vet reckons she's fine, but keep an eye on her just in case. She was really perky at the vets, had good poo, etc so I thought she's probably still sleepy in the morning.

When I returned home today (slightly later than usual because I had taken time off to bring her to the vet), she's not there to greet me. I had a look in her bowl, she's barely touched her breakfast. I checked her water bottle, she's barely drank as well. I panicked and paged for her vet (I missed the opening hours). While waiting for the vet to call back, I made some critical care and she took it off a spoon (about 8-10g of powder, she didn't want anymore after that. I made it watery so at least she would get some water). I'm also starting her tummy massages. Vet called back, and said it's good that she's at least taking the critical care and to give her that and tummy massages and see if she's just having a bad day. She's hunched over her peepan again now and I can tell she's not feeling too good.

Just for some history, she had exactly the same symptoms and problem 4-5 months ago but I was ignorant then and complicated the problem by bringing her to the wrong vet, etc, which led to stasis and prolapse. She survived her ordeal and was on the way to recovery (putting on weight) until this happened today. I have no idea why (we didn't know why it happened previously either because I wasted 2 weeks on bad vets and by the time I got her to a chin competent vet - her current one, her condition was very bad)

She's on a strict diet of Oxbow pellets (24g a day, free flow timothy which she doesn't like but I limit her pellets to make her eat it, and about 5g of critical care fed with a spoon everyday). She doesn't get any treats at all since her ordeal.

The vet I'm seeing is semi-retired and is not scheduled to work till next monday. He says I can keep him updated via the paging service and he'll try to help. I can bring her in to the clinic tomorrow, but it'll be a junior vet on duty and he's not too experienced with chins and after the bad vets experience, I'm not too sure if that will be any good too.

Does anyone have any advice for me?

p.s. Starting to exercise her too, but I don't want to strain her. She acts active and chirpy when I open the door, but once she's left on her own, she's clearly uncomfortable.

p.p.s All these started only this morning. She was totally fine yesterday.

thanks in advance for any advice! *and reading the wall of text!*

 

[Claire D]

Is she able to pee?

If she is in pain then she needs pain medication & a full examination from a vet - is she on any form of pain relief? She may also need gut stimulants but she needs examining first.
If you have been through this before then you already know she needs plenty of fluids & increased syringe foods if she is not able to eat on her own. If she is not drinking then she definitely needs some extra fluids - can you get to a vet & get pain relief & sub-cut fluids?

 

[ysy]

She is peeing. She peed her usual amount today.

She has no medication at all because when I brought her to the vet this morning, I hadn't noticed that she wasn't eating and didn't mention it to the vet. I just wanted her checked out before the holiday hits for her unusual behaviour this morning. She checked out okay (no x-rays or anything obviously, just a cursory look, and she was perky! I was beginning to think maybe she's just grumpy because it was cold this morning)

The dilemma I have is that my regular vet (one of 2 chin competent vets here) isn't working until next week due to a major holiday coming up. The emergency hospitals here are useless for chins. I have just tomorrow (before the major holiday hits and everywhere will be closed for 5 days till Monday) to get anything done.

I know for a fact that a non chin experience vet is on duty tomorrow, and I'm not sure bringing her in will do any good. Looks like my only option is to call an emergency and ask if my regular vet could make an exception and see her. The other way is to ask him if he could phone in a prescription, but he wouldn't have seen her.

It's just very bad timing

 

[ysy]

Update: I'm beginning to suspect that she has mild bloat but I'm not sure. Her tummy feels weird (didn't feel the same as 2 hours ago, seems harder but it could be the 10g of CC she took earlier on, but I never knew how a bloated stomach feels like, just an empty one). Let her out for exercise, actually forced her is a better word. She's now upset with me. She's refusing to let me massage her tummy so I didn't really get a good feel, but she took another 5g of CC (dry weight - I mixed it into a watery paste which I know she likes). Two new poos, slightly smaller and harder than usual. Previous poos were fine, but she pooed about 80% less today (but she didn't eat anything since breakfast)

She's still fiesty though, pushed my hands away when I tried to pick her up, and spider-chin climbed her cage (from the outside, because I refused to let her back in before she did at least 5 minutes of run).

I think I'm going to page her regular vet tomorrow and ask for an emergency appointment. It's 11:30pm here right now and I don't want to disturb my vet if it's not a real emergency. I will also be posting updates as often as I can about her progress, so please please at any point in time you guys think she should be rushed to a vet immediately, please tell me, because I know I'm a very poor judge of what is and what isn't an emergency.

Thanks so much!

 

[ysy]

update 2: An hour ago, she took another 5g of CC - off a dish, I just held it up for her. Found around 3-4 probable new poos, really miniscule and hard Forced her to run around a little, but all she wanted was to go back to her cage. She's sleeping now in her little hidey house but I can tell she's clearly not comfortable. That will be her last feeding tonight as I don't want to overload her system with food in one go.

She doesn't want me to massage her tummy, so I'm thinking it probably hurts. Can't wait for morning so I can start making phonecalls.

Claire - I'm not sure about the fluids, vet said over the phone to try to feed her water. She's having none of it, and I don't want to force it at this point in time - she has nasty memories of syringes and I don't want her to bolt once she sees me. How much fluid should I into her? Her CC mix is 1:1 so for every gram of CC she gets 1ml of fluid, so that's around 20ml so far (give or take)

 

[Claire D]

You can try making the syringe feed more fluid if she will take it - she needs more fluids & probably some pain relief if she is uncomfortable. She also needs gut stimulants if she is not producing droppings & is not eating - this is not something which can wait TBH.

You're going to need to aim for 50-60ml made up Critical Care in 24 hours - she needs you have plenty of high fibre foods going through her gut - I presume you had to do all this last time as well? You're going to have to force feed her if she is not getting enough because without it she is going to go into stasis.

 

[ysy]

Thanks Claire. I'm lucky that she's still taking Critical Care (off a spoon/dish) so no need to force feed yet. She certainly wasn't that co-operative the previous time, but I had wasted time with bad vets who didn't know what they were doing.

She's had about 30g (dry) + 30ml (water) mix altogether so far since last night without any trouble. I'm going to see if she wants more before I leave for work. She has no problem with CC, tried to eat pellets, but just had a few chews and dumped it. She pooped a great deal (30+) last night in her hidey house. All small, hard, classic constipation poos.

She had about 5 poos this morning as well (fresh) and these looked slightly better, larger (but still small) and softer. They have holes in them too, so it confirms my suspicion that she's gassy - which also explains why she doesn't want me massaging her stomach. It doesn't look that well-digested too - you can see the critical care.

Another hour to go before the clinics open. I'm going to try to get a chin competent vet to have a look at her today. Fingers crossed that I get an appointment.

 

[BooBoo*TheKiddo*]

I hope for her sake that her vet will come in and see her. Sounds like she is gonna need it.

 

[Riven]

Do you have access to simethicone drops? ( Baby gas drops) If so give her one full dropper every 4 hrs, it will relieve the gas, and continue to do what you're doing now. You're on the right path.

 

[ysy]

I didn't get her regular vet to look at her today, but got an appointment instead with another vet from the same clinic who's seen her for a previous eye infection (with good results) Her history is in the clinic's records as well as vet's notes and stuff so mainly I wanted to get some meds for her for the holidays just in case. This vet had a feel of the tummy area, no impaction, reckons she's a little gassy, and I got Simethicone, as well as Metoclopramide and Metacam (I asked, just in case) from him.

Kelly is also doing better on her own. Her poops look better as the day went by. She's pooping more as well. I saw her sitting on her shelf and she had a pile of poo where she's sitting yay!) Had 5g feedings before I went to work / before vet appointment in the afternoon / after we came back from the vets / before dinner. She's also starting to show interest in her pellets (btw, she LOVES her pellets), took one from my hand and actually finished it. And I think she took some (i have to weigh to be sure) while I was away having dinner as well.

She took another 7g of CC just now but is still not touching her hay or water. Behaviour- wise she also seems more alert and more active. So my plan is to keep up the CC feedings every 2-3 hours (wherever possible) and the meds for the next 2 days to stabilize her poo then slowly increase the time between feedings to see if she would feed herself.

Thanks everyone for their help and advice. I really appreciate it! Again, please let me know if anything doesn't sound right or if there's anything I should do but haven't done.

 

[ysy]

Hi guys,

I've got some good news and bad news. The good news is that Kelly is now eating her pellets. She's just finished the 6g I put in her bowl this morning. But the bad news is that I think she might have URI

Please let me know what you think as I've no experience with URIs and from reading about it I have no idea how wheezing sounds or a sneeze is.

This afternoon I came home from work (big holiday), fed Kelly her CC. She took it like a champ then I hear something that begins to make me concerned. I don't know how to describe it, but I'm going to try. She's huffing a lot. Like if you exhale hard and fast through your nose it comes out like a big "SSSSSS". She also made a couple of "sneeze" like sounds that is honestly pretty loud - one of which evens sounds like a cross between a keck and a bark. I also noticed her pulling back her nose and sneezing loudly.
And she wipes her nose after that. I had to leave then with a family appointment then and thought maybe she had something up her nose (CC maybe?) and is trying to remove it.

I've just reached home 15mins ago and fed her her cc. She wanted to come out of the cage and it was then she was making some noises like somewhat cooing sounds but not as clear. I think I hear a little wheezing too, and when I put my ear to her face, at times I can feel her blowing onto my face.

I paged for my vet's answering service. He has just called back (while I was in the middle of typing this post) I described the symptoms to him and he thinks it's a nasal irritation/congestion thing. He says that I can try and find some babies nasal congestion drops for her if there's any pharmacy still open (bloody holiday - I'm going to try gas stations) I asked if he thinks it's anything lower down - and he says he doubts it as usually the symptoms (if it's anything involving the lungs) would be more severe.

Kelly is still active and eating, no runny nose, clear eyes. I need advice. What should I do? There are no vets open till Monday and this is a really major holiday where all shops will close for at least 2 days.

 

[Chinmama]

It does sound like a URI. I've never heard of giving a chinchilla nasal congestion drops for babies, and I am not sure that this is safe? She will likely need some antibiotics to clear it up.

 

[StevieP]

One of my chins was put on diphenhydramine (childrens benadryl) for sneezing. I believe it is safe.

Did the vet tell you what dosage to give her?

 

[ysy]

I'm a nervous wreck. It's close to 6am now and I haven't slept a wink. It's very obvious that Kelly has a cold (URI). Her nose is really running now, and her wheezing's very obvious. I've paged for her vet twice at around 1.30am last night as I realised her symptoms were getting worse, and I was worried at the speed that everything is popping up. But he's not returning the call. The emergency lady who was manning the phone also tried to call him, but to no avail. I can't blame him though. Vets need to sleep too. And I won't notice my mobile buzzing if I'm sound asleep.

I've called around to see if I can get another e-vet, but none are chin experienced and some didn't even pick up the hotline. The lady manning the hotline told me I could try the hospital (which is 24 hours) but that hospital is notorious for being useless and no one ever goes there.

I've picked up her drops (driving 1 hour) to the A&E of a children's hospital whose pharmacy was the only one open at this hour. But I don't think the drops are going to help. Not when it's obvious it's an infection.

I'm now waiting for morning to page her vet again and arrange for a emergency (screw the public holiday) appointment asap.

Please keep Kelly in your thoughts...

On the bright side, she's still perky and trying to eat her pellets, and even nibble some hay... but it's obvious she isn't feeling so good.


I hope pneumonia hasn't hit

 

[ysy]

hi, need some help please.

My vet still has not called me back and Kelly is getting worse. I'm desperate. I'm now setting up an appointment with another vet from another clinic but he professes that he's not familiar with respiratory illnesses in chins. He's seen eye infection and digestion problems but not respiratory.

What do I need to know to advice the vet? I know Baytril is the drug of choice, but what else should I look for.

thanks!

p.s. will need help fast!

 

[sheri7]

Hi I'm no expert, but I just went thru this myself to a degree. My vet prescribed Baytril (.25ML every 12 hours).....BUT I think that may be a low dose possibly because my chin wasn't that bad so don't quote me on the dosage. He also prescribed Metacam every 24 hrs for 2-3 days which is a pain killer. They measured out the syringes for me so I don't recall the dose but did say do not give any more than that.

Since baytril and URI may cause a chin to lose appetite you might need to feed Critical Care.

This is the thread I started and I was given lots of advice by much more knowledgeable people than me.

 

[sheri7]

Sorry I don't know how to insert a link to another thread but its titled
"Chin Diagnosed with Statis and seems to be in lots of pain" and is just below this thread.

 

[ysy]

Thanks Sheri, I read your post. Yes it's very similar to what Kelly is going through. Except that Kelly went downhill very quickly. Huffing in the afternoon - peeping at night - wheezing late night.

Anyway, I got her to a vet in the morning who did x-rays and examine her chest. He's not very experienced with chins, but was kind enough to call and consult another chin competent vet in the same clinic. Her lungs are clear (thank god!) but there's severe nasal congestion. She's now on 6 days of injectable baytril.

Kelly is now refusing CC. It could be everytime she takes a bite, she'll choke because she's stuffed up so bad and now once she smells CC she runs in the opposite direction. She's having problems drinking as well, because she seems to choke everytime. I often see her at the water bottle, unsure if she wants to drink or not. I'm pretty sure she's thirsty though. I've since changed her bottle to the ball-bearing kind (for hamsters) and it'll dispense less water with each lick and see if she can handle that better.

I'm trying to force-feed her now that she's hardly eating and her poops are getting less and now really small. But she's having none of it as well, worse is if I try to press things, she'll start choking and wheezing again, probably from the struggling. I know if she doesn't eat soon, she'll start having digestive problems again (her xrays show no gas and full stomach, but that's 2 days ago - she hasn't eaten much since then)

I'm also nebulising her on the advice of my vet, it seems to clear her nose a little, but she still doesn't want to eat.

Anyone has any ideas on how to feed her? Or do I really have to force it even if she chokes and wheezes ( I do go very slowly - small amounts at a time)

 

[sheri7]

I wish I had some advice for you but I have trouble force feeding myself and I don't have the stuffy nose issues you are dealing with. I don't know why no one is replying to this thread....usually the experts chime right in. Maybe you should start a new thread.

 

[StevieP]

ysy,

Are you giving the congestion drops? If so, what is the name of them and what is the dosage (how many mL)?