Do some adult chins ever grow?

[kathiva]

I currently have a standard sapphire carrier chin that I bought from a breeder in May 2010, she was born in October 2009. The thing is that she is over a year, and she is still the same weight as when I got her, which is about 470 grams, I thought that she would grow, but she is over a year and no change, I also thought that when I got her that it was ok she was a little small, because she was still like a baby, but nothing has happened yet.

So I wondered if you guys think if I should keep her and keep waiting for her to grow, or to just sell her as a pet only, she is very nice, her parents are a pure standard from Shoots and her dad is a sapphire male from Seward. I was told that some chins don't grow until they are like 2 years old, and at the same time don't want to sell until I am very sure about it because she comes from very good parents.

 

[RDZCRanch]

It doesn't matter how nice the parents of a specific chin are. The parents could throw all of their worst genes together or their genes don't pair correctly so the kits don't come out nearly as nice as the parents. I don't think her size has anything to do with the sapphire gene. I've seen sapphire carrier females in the 900g+ range.

As a breeder breeding for quality, I do not buy a chinchilla based on what it's parents took or what lines the parents are out of. The chinchilla has to be high enough quality on its own. My one male that produced a grand show champion has no grand show champions in his background, neither did the female he was paired to. I feel like you still have a lot to learn before you continue breeding. You need to know quality and what you're looking for in possible breeders instead of just buying chins because their parents are from good lines.

It's up to you what to do with her, but I would never breed a female that small. Whatever redeeming qualities she has, they are not nearly enough to make up for the lack of size. It's also extremely dangerous for a female that small to carry and deliver kits, which you should know already. I doubt she will put on more than 100g more, I've never seen growth spurts more than 100g.

 

[Cuddlebug]

I agree with Tabitha. The little girl is not one I would breed; she is way too small.

 

[Megan]

It's not exactly judging on what the chin looks like, either. There are times when I have used chins that others may not, but had outstanding lines. but I also KNOW my lines, and the lines I breed. For me its not *only* about what you see, but what lies in the lines(not talking about champions here- but actual animals and ranches in the lines)

One thing people forget is that not every line works with one another. I know what my lines work with (mostly white woods), and who they tend to not mix well with. Just because you have two awesome chins doesn't mean you'll get something nice. You need to know if the lines you are breeding do well with each other.

And sadly.. sometimes we buy young and hope for the best-- and they never grow. However if she was born in Oct of 2009 she is just over 12 months old. Whats a few more months to hang onto it? If she grows great--but you know that you need a male from a line who tends to mature faster to try and even it out.

 

[kathiva]

I don't mind hanging onto her to see if she grows a little more, but the thing is that I have not even seen her growing a gram or two, nothing! so was wondering what to do with her, I have not bred her at all, I do know that I cannot breed her because she could die, but I have been waiting to see if she grows a bit more and nothing has happened

As to quality, I know I have a lot to learn still, I haven't said that I know everything about quality I have just started to be able to recognize better chins of quality, but I have tried to purchase good quality chins now and try to let the other ones that were not of so good quality go. And this little girl, unfortunately I bought her at about 6 months or so, thinking that she would grow, but nothing happened.

I thought that if she doesn't grow at all, she would have to go for sure to a pet home, too bad that this little girl didn't come out as nice as her parents , her fur is nice, but her size is not good at all, specially not for breeding.

Anyways, thank you guys for your input, I wanted to know what you thought about this, or if it had happened to you with another chin.

 

[kathiva]

Oh, now I remember that actually, when I got her she was around 439 or so, and now she weighs about 470, but I haven't seen her grow for at least 3 months or so. The thing is that I bought her over the internet, so when you do that, it is actually harder to know for sure if the chin is nice or not, compared to if you go purchase a chin at a show and you can see it before buying it, which I have to start going to shows soon

 

[jamanalo]

At times you sound contradicting. If I were you, I would go to as many possible shows or talk to a rancher because its too difficult to read about qualities and then to see whats in an online photo. The photos give justice, but you will never know what show quality or high quality is. What I dont follow when breeding is by using animals with only "brand names" All the large ranches have amazing reputations for being leaders in the industry of today, however, nature is nature. Chinchillas just dont make all show babies when using show parents. There can be the odd ones. Just because an animal has amazing bloodlines because of what a pedigree reads, doesnt mean its higher of quality. The only way of learning is to be attentive, focused, and honest.

 

[starleomach]

If she is 2 then she will not be growing. She is what she is

 

[kathiva]

At times you sound contradicting. If I were you, I would go to as many possible shows or talk to a rancher because its too difficult to read about qualities and then to see whats in an online photo. The photos give justice, but you will never know what show quality or high quality is. What I dont follow when breeding is by using animals with only "brand names" All the large ranches have amazing reputations for being leaders in the industry of today, however, nature is nature. Chinchillas just dont make all show babies when using show parents. There can be the odd ones. Just because an animal has amazing bloodlines because of what a pedigree reads, doesnt mean its higher of quality. The only way of learning is to be attentive, focused, and honest.

First of all, I was given this chin as a replacement for another one, as the one I had bought passed right before being shipped, so that was the only standard sapphire carrier female that she had so she had to give me that one.

I have not bought chins with only brand names, I have tried to buy the best that I can with the resources I have available, I have not been able to go to a show for now because it is too far, too costly and I am not a citizen yet to cross the border and have never driven alone so far, I have to get a visa and for that I have to be sure that I want to go on a certain date, it is my plan to go to shows but not yet, I would like to go with someone though, hopefully splitting some costs and time of driving, but it is in my plans for sure, I never said that I do not want to go to shows, because I do know that I have to see it for myself and I can't wait to really go to one!

My intention was to know if any of you guys have ever had a chin that has never grown or hardly grown because I am not planning to breed her at all right now, and no, I am not going to risk her life for just breeding as she does not deserve it

 

[kathiva]

If she is 2 then she will not be growing. She is what she is

She should be 2 next year in October, but someone said that some chins don't grow until they are like two, and that I should not give up on her because she comes from good parents, but I can't prove that the baby was going to be as nice as the parents

Here I have an example, my dad got me Cherry about a year ago (he picked her and I wasn't there at the moment), she was from a good breeder, and I read her pedigree, she came from a pure standard mom and a violet male, which you think that it would be great, but no, I am having to sell this girl now because I think that her quality is not so good, so it is like that, when breeding, sometimes you have to sell some chins that are not of so good quality and acquire others to improve your herd, and it is a long process, to actually find the right chins, have enough money, time, etc, and actually be lucky, because sometimes is hard to find the exact chin that you want. I am trying to improve what I have here, and it has not been very easy, but I keep trying because I like to do what I do, which is raise these chins and raise them good (that means quality and good care).

 

[kathiva]

At times you sound contradicting. If I were you, I would go to as many possible shows or talk to a rancher because its too difficult to read about qualities and then to see whats in an online photo. The photos give justice, but you will never know what show quality or high quality is. What I dont follow when breeding is by using animals with only "brand names" All the large ranches have amazing reputations for being leaders in the industry of today, however, nature is nature. Chinchillas just dont make all show babies when using show parents. There can be the odd ones. Just because an animal has amazing bloodlines because of what a pedigree reads, doesnt mean its higher of quality. The only way of learning is to be attentive, focused, and honest.

Yes, I do know that you do not always get show babies from show parents because of the genetics, you can get all kinds of different babies from a pair, some smaller babies or some larger babies, or some babies with nicer fur and some with not as nice, even their faces, some babies have their faces like their dad or some like their mom, is amazing what you can get from one pair.

 

[Christina Noraas]

I'm not a breeder, nor do I know much about breeding chinchillas. However, I know that when we breed two pure breed Angus's together for too long we get extremely mean calves, who often times have other issues which makes the calf useless for selling because no one wants a calf with that many issues. My uncle also has a dog who is a pure bred but has seizures and such because there is just too much pure bred in her.

Sometimes too much of a good thing isn't really good.

 

[RDZCRanch]

Here I have an example, my dad got me Cherry about a year ago (he picked her and I wasn't there at the moment), she was from a good breeder, and I read her pedigree, she came from a pure standard mom and a violet male, which you think that it would be great, but no, I am having to sell this girl now because I think that her quality is not so good, so it is like that, when breeding, sometimes you have to sell some chins that are not of so good quality and acquire others to improve your herd, and it is a long process, to actually find the right chins, have enough money, time, etc, and actually be lucky, because sometimes is hard to find the exact chin that you want. I am trying to improve what I have here, and it has not been very easy, but I keep trying because I like to do what I do, which is raise these chins and raise them good (that means quality and good care).

It doesn't take luck to get a good chinchilla. It takes patience and being very selective when you talk to breeders about purchasing a chinchilla. I absolutely will not buy a chinchilla unless it has either been shown and I'm given the judges comments or I've seen it in person. I also, typically, will not buy a kit because you never know if they will grow into what you want or not.

I think the general consensus has been for you to halt your breeding for now until you can get to a show. I understand not being able to go to a show, but until you get to one and can start seeing quality in person and getting a feel for it, you should halt your breeding. I'm not saying stop breeding forever, just put your pairs into same sex cages until you can get to a show and gain more knowledge. It's not a horrible or difficult thing, but it guarantees you aren't breeding poor quality chins. Even the best of breeders can become barn blind(thinking their animals are the best) from not going to shows and the chins they think are excellent quality take low awards on the table.

As far as this s/c girl, I would not hold onto her for another year. Just my preference...if a chinchilla takes longer than 12 months to reach an acceptable size, I will not keep it for breeding. Also, as I said before, I don't think she will get enough of a "growth spurt" to ever reach an acceptable size. At two years old, she won't miracle into a wonderful 800-900g chinchilla. I doubt she will even get to 600g with the weight she is at now. I personally would have a lot of trouble with the idea of breeding a female under 700g when breeding for quality.

 

[kathiva]

It doesn't take luck to get a good chinchilla. It takes patience and being very selective when you talk to breeders about purchasing a chinchilla. I absolutely will not buy a chinchilla unless it has either been shown and I'm given the judges comments or I've seen it in person. I also, typically, will not buy a kit because you never know if they will grow into what you want or not.

I think the general consensus has been for you to halt your breeding for now until you can get to a show. I understand not being able to go to a show, but until you get to one and can start seeing quality in person and getting a feel for it, you should halt your breeding. I'm not saying stop breeding forever, just put your pairs into same sex cages until you can get to a show and gain more knowledge. It's not a horrible or difficult thing, but it guarantees you aren't breeding poor quality chins. Even the best of breeders can become barn blind(thinking their animals are the best) from not going to shows and the chins they think are excellent quality take low awards on the table.

As far as this s/c girl, I would not hold onto her for another year. Just my preference...if a chinchilla takes longer than 12 months to reach an acceptable size, I will not keep it for breeding. Also, as I said before, I don't think she will get enough of a "growth spurt" to ever reach an acceptable size. At two years old, she won't miracle into a wonderful 800-900g chinchilla. I doubt she will even get to 600g with the weight she is at now. I personally would have a lot of trouble with the idea of breeding a female under 700g when breeding for quality.

Consensus? oh, well, I might consider it then but will see, but thanks for your opinion, and I think you are right about this girl not growing, I guess that was the way she was born then.
And yes, it's true that even if she reaches 600 grams, which is not so bad, it would still not give me such good quality chins, 700 grams and up is the best.

As to luck, I meant luck, because sometimes the most gorgeous chins are the ones that go faster! jejeje, but yes, I do know that it requires time and patience in deciding what chins to buy, and of course it is always best to see them.
Too bad that with this chin, I did not think that she was going to be so small, but it was a last minute decision since the one I had picked passed right before the chins were going to be shipped. Anyways, I will most likely sell this little girl, but not yet, as she is babysitting one baby girl that is growing now, and she is making her company.

 

[jamanalo]

I am partial with Tab. You also seem to have a clear set $$$ in mind. Something that shouldn't really be conscious especially if you're starting up. Also, if you do post pics of animals in very filthy conditions, no one will buy your animals because the negative reputation it creates. If you have cages getting caked with green, and kits with diarrhea, maybe there are too many for you to handle? As much as you feel that caring for them is sufficient, it may be just too much.
If you have pet animals, you need to rehome them, not so much the intention of "selling".

 

[ticklechin]

I don't understand if your herd has not been judged and you have little experience with what is a show quality chin, why keep making kits to make kits. Get your herd judged, cull what is not good quality and get serious about improving your quality of animals. You have already had deaths from neglect and had to get rid of a bunch because you could not handle them, maybe you need to just have some pets to enjoy till you get more experience and money to get it right. And that means going to many shows also.

 

[tunes]

How far are you from Randy's place (JAGS)? I seem to remember you got some chins from him, or were going to get some chins from him, so he can't be THAT far. Randy can certainly teach you about quality animals. And, before you make a comment about it being too far, please keep in mind that I drive 16 hours each way to get to Indiana just to pick up supplies and watch Nationals. You don't have to go every weekend, but for pete sake go at least ONCE.

Kathiva, you have an excuse or an evasion for everything. We all know that no matter how much we beg, plead, or rationalize, you are not going to stop breeding. You don't care if you breed crap. As long as you keep churning out cute fuzzy babies, that's your purpose in life. You can sell them, put a little money in your pocket, and think you've done a wonderful thing.

Frankly, I wish you would stop asking breeding questions period. Answering them is an exercise in futility and I don't know why people continue to waste their fingers pounding their keyboards, or their minds attempting to formulate an answer that even you can understand, though you continue to ignore.

Sell the freaking chin. She's too small, she's not suddenly going to grow to 800 gm, and judging by your experience with "quality" animals, she's not worth breeding anyway.

Forum members, please, stop telling her to quit breeding. It's not going to do any good and all you do is get frustrated all over again.

 

[starleomach]

Kathiva, you have an excuse or an evasion for everything. We all know that no matter how much we beg, plead, or rationalize, you are not going to stop breeding. You don't care if you breed crap. As long as you keep churning out cute fuzzy babies, that's your purpose in life. You can sell them, put a little money in your pocket, and think you've done a wonderful thing.

Frankly, I wish you would stop asking breeding questions period. Answering them is an exercise in futility and I don't know why people continue to waste their fingers pounding their keyboards, or their minds attempting to formulate an answer that even you can understand, though you continue to ignore.

Sell the freaking chin. She's too small, she's not suddenly going to grow to 800 gm, and judging by your experience with "quality" animals, she's not worth breeding anyway.

Forum members, please, stop telling her to quit breeding. It's not going to do any good and all you do is get frustrated all over again.

:clap1::clap1::clap1::clap1::clap1:

 

[kathiva]

I don't understand if your herd has not been judged and you have little experience with what is a show quality chin, why keep making kits to make kits. Get your herd judged, cull what is not good quality and get serious about improving your quality of animals. You have already had deaths from neglect and had to get rid of a bunch because you could not handle them, maybe you need to just have some pets to enjoy till you get more experience and money to get it right. And that means going to many shows also.

No, not all of them, I only have a few that were judge because I was able to purchase some, that had already been taken to a show and judge, and those ones had done good at the shows that they went.

I realize that I do have little experience, but of course I would, I need to keep learning, and it might take me a while, but at least I want to learn, I am not perfect, but I want to give it a try because I like it.

And yes, it is my intention to go to show to get many of my animals judged.

 

[kathiva]

How far are you from Randy's place (JAGS)? I seem to remember you got some chins from him, or were going to get some chins from him, so he can't be THAT far. Randy can certainly teach you about quality animals. And, before you make a comment about it being too far, please keep in mind that I drive 16 hours each way to get to Indiana just to pick up supplies and watch Nationals. You don't have to go every weekend, but for pete sake go at least ONCE.

Kathiva, you have an excuse or an evasion for everything. We all know that no matter how much we beg, plead, or rationalize, you are not going to stop breeding. You don't care if you breed crap. As long as you keep churning out cute fuzzy babies, that's your purpose in life. You can sell them, put a little money in your pocket, and think you've done a wonderful thing.

Frankly, I wish you would stop asking breeding questions period. Answering them is an exercise in futility and I don't know why people continue to waste their fingers pounding their keyboards, or their minds attempting to formulate an answer that even you can understand, though you continue to ignore.

Sell the freaking chin. She's too small, she's not suddenly going to grow to 800 gm, and judging by your experience with "quality" animals, she's not worth breeding anyway.

Forum members, please, stop telling her to quit breeding. It's not going to do any good and all you do is get frustrated all over again.

Ok, thanks, I understand your point, I am sorry, it was not my intention to ignore your suggestions, maybe it was the way I formulated my answers, and now I am also trying to change the way I think about quality animals, and what to do,

As to Jags, I believe he is about 11 or 12 hours I believe, but I have to plan the trip good and with time, I have been able to speak with him in the past and he is a very nice person, so for sure most likely will go to see him first for advice and to show me how to recognize some good quality animals

But guys, please do not get upset, I just do not mean to get everyone upset about this, I don't know, it just seems that everytime I ask a question, everyone starts talking about other things, and as to I do this and that, and here we go, I don't really mean to get anybody upset or anything, and I do want to try to follow some advice and see your input or suggestions,