Castration Question

[Chinbutt]

Hi folks,

First off I'm sorry for not posting this in the Vet questions forum. I can't seem to start a new thread there.

One of the main reasons I joined this site is because I wanted to get some input on this very topic.

I have two chins, one male (4 years old) and one female (3 years old). They live in their own cages which are side by side. They seem to really like each other, and often paw at each other/play kissy face through a double set of bars. They've been exposed to each other for over a year now.

My girlfriend works for a computer parts/programming company, and often works from our home office. During the day she has them out (one at a time) fairly often. Our female will run around for about 10 minutes and then nap in my girlfriend's lap while she works. The male is pretty wild with his wall surfing, but usually retires to a floor pillow to sleep most of the day.

While they enjoy their play time a whole bunch, they often spend time at the front of each other's cages playing kissy face through a single set of bars. In my mind, they really love each other. I would love to have them in a single cage, and I'm sure they feel the same way. Thing is, breeding is not something I want to get into. As much fun as it would be, I'd be worried about finding them homes and probably end up keeping them. I could see us being overwhelmed by it all, and each individual chin not getting the same kind of attention my two are used to.

I've spoken with one vet and she thinks they should probably be together. She says she can handle a chinchilla castration and has performed roughly a dozen over the years. She says it's very similar to a guinea pig.

The only reason I haven't done it yet is that I fear the procedure and whether or not it's more dangerous to a chin than it is a dog or cat. I'm also concerned about whether or not it will change his personality a whole bunch. He's a very unique and charming little guy, and I would hate to mess with that.

Any input is greatly appreciated, as I've been thinking about this a whole lot recently.

Thanks in advance!

 

[tunes]

Right now they are curious about each other, but what is driving them is the natural, biological urge to mate. It's not that I don't think animals get attached to each other, I absolutely do, but that is usually animals who have lived together as cagemates, not "generally" ones that are just running around who visit through bars.

Here's the thing with castration. It's a risk, both the surgery and the aftermath. I am not anti-castration at all, but what you need to realize is you may go through this, put them together in the same cage after a prolonged time to be sure the sperm is all dead, and then they fight to the death. There is just no way to know. Even chins who have lived together for 10 years can turn on each other and one ends up dead.

As far as personality change, there is no way to know that either for sure. He may be the same, he may become more aggressive. Each chin is unique. She may also hate him on sight after he comes back from the vet. It has happened more than once with other people who have tried this. They got their chins neutered only to be unable to reintroduce them after.

Also something to be aware of, if they can get at each other through the bars, then they can mate. There have been chins who have ended up getting pregnant this way.

 

[Chinbutt]

Right now they are curious about each other, but what is driving them is the natural, biological urge to mate. It's not that I don't think animals get attached to each other, I absolutely do, but that is usually animals who have lived together as cagemates, not "generally" ones that are just running around who visit through bars.

Here's the thing with castration. It's a risk, both the surgery and the aftermath. I am not anti-castration at all, but what you need to realize is you may go through this, put them together in the same cage after a prolonged time to be sure the sperm is all dead, and then they fight to the death. There is just no way to know. Even chins who have lived together for 10 years can turn on each other and one ends up dead.

As far as personality change, there is no way to know that either for sure. He may be the same, he may become more aggressive. Each chin is unique. She may also hate him on sight after he comes back from the vet. It has happened more than once with other people who have tried this. They got their chins neutered only to be unable to reintroduce them after.

Also something to be aware of, if they can get at each other through the bars, then they can mate. There have been chins who have ended up getting pregnant this way.

Thanks for all the input Tunes, it's really helpful as these are the things I've been thinking about.

One thing I thought was odd (only because of my own inexperience) is that the vet suggested letting them play together (supervised of course) in a neutral area like the bathroom before getting him neutered to ensure they are compatible and get along.

Of course my question was "Won't he instantly try to mount her?" The vet said he would try, but that I could simply push him off and continue to monitor their interactions. I was surprised by this because I would expect him to only have one thing on his mind, being the young hormone filled male that he is.

What are your opinions on trying to let them play together before he is neutered with my close supervision?

 

[tunes]

Nooooo - no play time together at all, supervised or not. It literally takes seconds for them to breed. Your vet is not giving you good information in this regard. By the time you were to bat him off, the deed could already be done.

 

[cindyv3737]

Thanks for all the input Tunes, it's really helpful as these are the things I've been thinking about.

One thing I thought was odd (only because of my own inexperience) is that the vet suggested letting them play together (supervised of course) in a neutral area like the bathroom before getting him neutered to ensure they are compatible and get along.

Of course my question was "Won't he instantly try to mount her?" The vet said he would try, but that I could simply push him off and continue to monitor their interactions. I was surprised by this because I would expect him to only have one thing on his mind, being the young hormone filled male that he is.

What are your opinions on trying to let them play together before he is neutered with my close supervision?

I would not let them play together even with supervision. Mating only takes a second. Blink and the deed is done. It's safer keeping them apart.

 

[Tagna]

Breeding takes seconds so I wouldn't do it.

 

[jess32247]

It would be a bad idea to let them interact any closer then they are now, though it is possible for them to mate between the bars of the cages if it were close enough like Tunes said. It only takes a few seconds to get the job done.

 

[Chinbutt]

Nooooo - no play time together at all, supervised or not. It literally takes seconds for them to breed. Your vet is not giving you good information in this regard. By the time you were to bat him off, the deed could already be done.

That's more or less what I thought. I had a feeling her suggestion might not be the greatest idea, even though she seems pretty knowledgeable about chins.

Thanks again Tunes, I really do appreciate the input.

 

[Chinbutt]

I would not let them play together even with supervision. Mating only takes a second. Blink and the deed is done. It's safer keeping them apart.

Breeding takes seconds so I wouldn't do it.

Imo, I think it would be a bad idea to let them interact any closer then they are now, though it is possible for them to mate between the bars of the cages if it were close enough like Tunes said. It only takes a few seconds to get the job done.

Thank you all for the input.

So basically it's a roll of the dice getting him neutered, I have no way of knowing whether or not they'll get along once the bars are out of the way.

What do you folks think about the odds/chances of pairing them post castration? They've lived in close proximity for over a year now, and I never see any signs of aggression or anything negative.

I know Tunes said they can turn on each other after years, etc. But is this the exception or the rule?

 

[tunes]

I know Tunes said they can turn on each other after years, etc. But is this the exception or the rule?

Again, and I know I sound like an eejit repeating myself, but this completely depends on the chins. There is just no way to know until you are in the situation. There are numerous stories on this forum of chins who have lived together for years and years, seemingly very closely bonded, who for something as stupid as not wanting to share a water bottle will suddenly rip their cage mate apart. It is a horrid, horrid thing to see. Chins can be incredibly vicious. They usually jump on the back of the chin they want to attack and start ripping into the ears, eyes, nose, back of the head, and down their back. Many a chin has died from injuries sustained this way. They have ripped off ears, lost eyes, punctured lungs. Chins can be brutal little savages when they turn on a cage mate. It is just awful.

 

[Chinbutt]

Again, and I know I sound like an eejit repeating myself, but this completely depends on the chins. There is just no way to know until you are in the situation. There are numerous stories on this forum of chins who have lived together for years and years, seemingly very closely bonded, who for something as stupid as not wanting to share a water bottle will suddenly rip their cage mate apart. It is a horrid, horrid thing to see. Chins can be incredibly vicious. They usually jump on the back of the chin they want to attack and start ripping into the ears, eyes, nose, back of the head, and down their back. Many a chin has died from injuries sustained this way. They have ripped off ears, lost eyes, punctured lungs. Chins can be brutal little savages when they turn on a cage mate. It is just awful.

Yikes. Well thank you for being brutally honest with me Tunes. I need to think about this quite a bit more. I might just leave things as is, since they are both happy & healthy.

 

[tcraighenry]

So this is the dark side of castration. We had a situation where the two boys we got off CL turned out to be a boy and a girl. We had the boy neutered and he died the day after of shock. He went into stasis.

It was devastating. To this day we regret not just putting them in separate cages.

It does happen.

 

[Brittany]

I just want to add one more thing for you to consider. As mentioned, there is always a risk of complications with surgery. If you do decide to get him castrated PLEASE pick up a bag of Critical Care (syringe feed) and feeding syringes prior to having the surgery done. I don't know how many times I see someone posting about a sick chin who won't eat, and the owner doesn't have access to what they need to hand feed them. Hopefully you won't need it, but it's cheap and good to have on hand, because if your chin goes off his feed it will be late at night, on the weekend, when the vet is closed. That's just the way it goes. :thumbsup:

 

[Chinbutt]

So this is the dark side of castration. We had a situation where the two boys we got off CL turned out to be a boy and a girl. We had the boy neutered and he died the day after of shock. He went into stasis.

It was devastating. To this day we regret not just putting them in separate cages.

It does happen.

I just want to add one more thing for you to consider. As mentioned, there is always a risk of complications with surgery. If you do decide to get him castrated PLEASE pick up a bag of Critical Care (syringe feed) and feeding syringes prior to having the surgery done. I don't know how many times I see someone posting about a sick chin who won't eat, and the owner doesn't have access to what they need to hand feed them. Hopefully you won't need it, but it's cheap and good to have on hand, because if your chin goes off his feed it will be late at night, on the weekend, when the vet is closed. That's just the way it goes. :thumbsup:

Thanks a bunch you two. This definitely gives my g/f and I more food for thought when discussing this. I would be devastated too if anything happened to my little guy, he means the world to me.

I may just keep them in their separate cages. Their lives are really good right now so I might leave things as they are.

 

[ticklechin]

If you do decide to do it and need a vet recommendation, Adobe Pet hospital in Los altos, Dr. Jane Johnson, she had done many many neuters for CAchins rescue, this vet is also open 24/7/365, and has 7 or 8 vets who see chins, just a FYI in case of a emergency on sun afternoon and you need a vet asap.

 

[Gumby and Elmo]

My 2 boys were castrated about 7 yrs ago, all went well and they came home after a day, I thought that was easy until Gumby didn't want to eat, I don't know if it was the baytril they prescribed or just straight pain that made my little boy stop eating.
I had some cc on hand and started to force feed him straight away, having to hold him and stick a syringe into his mouth was the last thing I wanted to do, I was so cautious about his stitches, it really wasn't an easy job.
I got up every couple of hrs to feed him cc, his meds, then the probiotic a little later, luckily, he started to take the cc off the syringe on his own and it got easier by then as I didn't have to pick him up anymore, the whole ordeal took about a month until he was back on his feet.
Elmo, on the other hand, ate on his own straight away, the baytril or the op had no side effects on him at all.

 

[Snickers]

I had about 5 neutered by the same vet at different times. The surgery was done in the morning then I would pick them up that same afternoon. I had no complication knock on wood so far. The only thing to remember is that they cannot have a bath for 10 days. I will then put them with a female after the 10 days in a different cage. I watch them to make sure they will get along.

 

[Sycamore Chins]

Even after neutering they should be kept separate from the female for 4-6 weeks (most err on the side of 6 weeks) There can still be some swimmers in the system and they could still get a female pregnant!

 

[AZChins]

That's right, Alicyn. It doesn't happen much, but it can happen after even a month.

It isn't the same with chins and a dog may be a poor example. We have a dog that made a puppy over 30 days AFTER he was neutered. The mom was 4 lbs, the dad is 7 lbs and the puppy as an adult is 21 lbs. Very weird stuff. I can see it happening with a chinchilla because the females go into heat so often. Be careful with that!!

 

[Chinbutt]

If you do decide to do it and need a vet recommendation, Adobe Pet hospital in Los altos, Dr. Jane Johnson, she had done many many neuters for CAchins rescue, this vet is also open 24/7/365, and has 7 or 8 vets who see chins, just a FYI in case of a emergency on sun afternoon and you need a vet asap.

Thanks Tickle, I was about to PM you for your vet info since Momenteller recommended I get in touch with you. I'd just like to have a solid experienced Chinchilla vet to turn to in case I ever need it. Mine have never had any problems but you never know.

As for the castration I really just don't know. These replies honestly have me worried and I love my little guy so much I couldn't bear to have anything go wrong. I might just leave things as they are.

I really appreciate all the comments, they've been super helpful. And that's exactly why I joined up here in the first place.