handfeeding need help/advice!

[chinchillasrox]

If you read my earlier post, my momma chin died on Sat night/Sun morning. The babies are still alive and eating but I need some advice and help.

On Sat Pepper weighed 78 (pre momma's death).....by the time babies were found and started hand feeding on Sun morning he was down to 76. Mon afternoon he was back up to 78 and this afternoon he's at 80....so some gain. Is that enough or should I be worried. Basically he's back to his previous weight

Oli was 71 Sat (he's always been 8 to 11 g behind his bro).....down to 67 by Sun morning, still at 67 yesterday afternoon and up to 68 this afternoon. So not much gain at all, still below previous weight. He is SO hard to get to eat. He eats as much as his bro most of the time but fights it really bad. I'm afraid he's using so much energy trying to get away from us feeding him. I've tried lots of postions, different droppers and even wrapped him up. The last couple feedings were better but he still fights it like crazy.

They are getting fed every 2 hours and are eating between 1.5 and 2 ml at a feeding..........oh, they are 12 days old.

Also my daughter read to make a pouch and let them be in the pouch up against your chest, any thoughts on that?

We really want to keep these babies alive so any help/advice is great. The whole family has read the sections on hand feeding and they are great but some feedback would be good.

I've talked to 2 vets and got totaly different advice.......one said use kitten replacer, the other said evaperated milk. We opted for the goats milk recipe here. One vet said to add a bit of glucose to the mix.

So, anyone who has had to hand feed kits please let me know how you did it and what worked. I'm willing to try anything to keep these babies alive.

 

[tunes]

You don't need to add glucose or anything else other than what the recipe states. Kitten milk is for kittens. Kittens are not herbivores, they eat meat, so their formula is inappropriate for an herbivore like a chin. You can use evaporated milk in a pinch, but why bother when you have access to the correct kind to use, which is the goats milk?

It sounds as though they are doing fine. As long as they are gaining, even if it's a little bit, that's fine for now. It's going to take them a little while to get over the trauma of their mother being mauled to death and getting adjusted to their new way of feeding. Just be patient and keep plugging away at it as you are.

 

[Mikayla]

Just thought I'd mention, evaporated milk is what most very experienced ranchers here use with success. Though I used goats milk, I don't see why evaporated milk couldn't be used.

 

[ticklechin]

Doesn't evporated milk have a ton more sugar than goats milk? Do kits need sugar? I don't do kits I am just curious.

 

[Mikayla]

I think if you buy the not sweetened kind it doesn't. But don't take my word for that, I don't use it, but it must work fine.

 

[chinchillasrox]

Thanks, we are using the goats milk. Realisticaly have either of you had to hand raise a baby, how often do they survive? At what point or what are signs I should be worried? I don't mind the work (the whole family is helping, even my mother who does not live with us).
I know I'm asking too many questions but I wasn't prepared for babies let alone having to hand feed and take care of. What about when I HAVE to be away from home, can they tavel with us? If so how? Next week we have some dentist apt's that I don't want to change but I can't leave the babies at home for 4 or 5 hours (the dentist is 30 min away). I work from home 3 days a week and my daughter and mom are here the other days but......(my poor husband tried but is not gentle and afraid he'll shove too much milk in for now).

 

[tunes]

They will survive for 4 or 5 hours, providing it's not a constant thing. But they'll be fine if you go to the dentist. You can also make up the dry formula, which is in the FAQ along with the wet mix, and put that in the cage with them. They usually start munching on it right away.

I've hand fed bunches of kits. The only time I have had failures was with very small (30 used to be my magic number, now it's 22 gm at birth) or with a kit that has been beaten so badly that it's either in shock or can't eat because of damage to it's face. I have a girl here I hand fed who has half her lip and part of her cheek missing from a fight between kits, and she's going on a year now and doesn't let it bother her at all.

 

[chinchillasrox]

Oh tunes that is a relief (that you've had so many survive) I just don't want to loose them too. Should I do the dry mix and leave it in the cage all the time just in case they want some??
Would it be crazy to take them with us and feed there or would it be bad for them to travel?

 

[Mikayla]

I traveled with Maia, and she was fine. But I don't think a Dentist would allow them inside, and it's too hot and unsafe to leave them in the car for that long. I think they'd probably be fine for 4-5 hours, but not much longer.

 

[chinchillasrox]

Thanks.... We will most def. try the dry mix. (Tunes, that is the ont with the crushed pellets and calf/goats milk powder, Right)

 

[Cuddlebug]

Yes, the dry mix is made with dried goat's milk, crushed pellets and baby cereal.

 

[tunes]

Yes, leave it in the cage with them all the time. Refresh it if they pee in it or if it gets filled up with shavings and poos.

Also, make sure the goat's milk powder doesn't have a bunch of antibiotics in it. Some of the formulas do.

 

[chinchillasrox]

Update......I had my dentist apt date wrong and it was today. We packed up the little ones (aka Fuzz Butts, my daughters nick name for them). I got a smallish fabric type carrier (probably for hamsters or guin. pigs), we put the dry supliment in their cage and took milk and feeding droppers. I put the milk in a container in a small lunch box w/ a ice pack and put the whole "mess" in a large beach bag.

We went in the dentist and I pulled a large syringe of food out and left it in the car to warm up and left the rest in the lunch box. We just sat the beach bag down and didn't say a word. At the end of the apt we told the hygenist (she is a huge animal fan) and they whole office wanted to see them and invited them back anytime ; )

We then went out to the car and fed them, they didn't eat great but ate enough. Then we were off to a restaurant. We just took the beach bag in and sat it in a chair beside me (I know how many rules were we breaking......and I'm a rule follower). After we ate we fed them again (not 2 hours but they didn't eat great the last time) once again they ate some. At that point their dry mix had spilled and they were playing in it....really cute.

Then we went to a small science center and repeated the same process. No one noticed or even seemed to care that I was carring a HUGE beach bag as a purse.

When we got home from our adventure I weighed them both and they had both gained 1g!!! I'm guessing it may have been from cleaning all the dry food off themselves. They both ate like rock stars when we got home!!

So, our first outing was a success. I think I was more nervous than the first time I took my "real" child out.

 

[EMSChins]

To determine whether or not the kits are gaining weight, you need to weigh them at the same time each day - gaining 1 gm throughout the course of the day doesn't necessarily mean that they are gaining weight. Weight can be affected by just eating, drinking and pooping.

 

[chinchillasrox]

we are... our vet told us to weigh them after every feeding though to make sure they are staying about the same weight

 

[tunes]

I just want to say, for other new people reading this, that was a HUGE risk you took with those little ones. Leaving them by necessity while you went to the dentist is one thing. Dragging them to not one, but three places loaded with unknowns, was not a good idea. You didn't have to go to the science center or the restaraunt, that was a choice that could have been avoided in order to get them home. You may think everything went hunky dory, but what if someone there was ill, had something that could have passed to the little ones? They have pretty much zero defense against that right now.

This is what I and many other breeders face every day. We make the choice to stay home and care for those kits, giving up many things in order to do it. This is also what we try and point out to people who think it's all cute fuzzy kits and loads of fun.
There are times you sacrifice what you want to do in order to care for the kits. It's that simple.

BTW, your vet is wrong. You don't weigh them after feeding. You pick one time a day, the same time EVERY day, and that's when you weigh them. You can't tell if they are staying consistent weights by weighing them after you feed them. That doesn't even make sense. If one eats 1mL and the other eats 3 mL, how will you know it's a consistent weight?

 

[EMSChins]

Peggy (Tunes) - thanks for backing me up on what I told the OP about weights...and more importantly for what I couldn't find the right words for (or the guts, I'm not sure).

 

[Airyn]

I typically don't comment on these threads, as I'm limited to my one experience with Nixi. BUT, I just wanted to share that the best thing I ever bought was one of these Smart Mugs from Amazon. The mug plugs into your car adapter and you can set the temp up to 160 if I remember correctly.

Nixi came to a wedding with me three hours away, so I kept a back-up tupperware container full of the goats milk formula in a cooler in case the milk in the mug curdled. She drank it all day long and I never needed to go for the back-up. I did have to adjust the feeding schedule a bit, as she wasn't eating as much as she would normally, but I think that was just a result of the vast amount of sensory input for her little system. I would imagine that a wedding is just as big of a deal for a kit as it is for the newlyweds.

Good luck!!!

Edit: She WAS left in a quiet hotel room for the majority of the wedding. The mug was used during travel only.

 

[chinchillasrox]

I just want to say, for other new people reading this, that was a HUGE risk you took with those little ones. Leaving them by necessity while you went to the dentist is one thing. Dragging them to not one, but three places loaded with unknowns, was not a good idea. You didn't have to go to the science center or the restaraunt, that was a choice that could have been avoided in order to get them home. You may think everything went hunky dory, but what if someone there was ill, had something that could have passed to the little ones? They have pretty much zero defense against that right now.

This is what I and many other breeders face every day. We make the choice to stay home and care for those kits, giving up many things in order to do it. This is also what we try and point out to people who think it's all cute fuzzy kits and loads of fun.
There are times you sacrifice what you want to do in order to care for the kits. It's that simple.


I didin't know that. We won't do that next time.

 

[Mikayla]

I typically don't comment on these threads, as I'm limited to my one experience with Nixi. BUT, I just wanted to share that the best thing I ever bought was one of these Smart Mugs from Amazon. The mug plugs into your car adapter and you can set the temp up to 160 if I remember correctly.

Nixi came to a wedding with me three hours away, so I kept a back-up tupperware container full of the goats milk formula in a cooler in case the milk in the mug curdled. She drank it all day long and I never needed to go for the back-up. I did have to adjust the feeding schedule a bit, as she wasn't eating as much as she would normally, but I think that was just a result of the vast amount of sensory input for her little system. I would imagine that a wedding is just as big of a deal for a kit as it is for the newlyweds.

Good luck!!!

Edit: She WAS left in a quiet hotel room for the majority of the wedding. The mug was used during travel only.

If only could have known this with Maia...