Chinchillas.com article about feed

[Spoof]

Thanks Mark, I was wondering about the long term effects of a higher crude fat. Using the custom milled formula have you had an equivalent upswing in production? I've been keeping an eye on the major feeds as they are all changing up their formulas. Last time I was at the feed store Manna Pro had a new bag and is now advertised corn free.

Would you mind sharing the ratios/percentages of the pellet you have milled?

That article looks like a combination of a couple articles and is all over the place. It is interesting.

 

[ticklechin]

Chinchillas are built for a low protein and fat diet, not sure why its such a revelation that fed a higher fat diet such as going from 2.5%-3.% to 3.5% would not do enything but result in a fatter chin with a fat layer.

 

[ticklechin]

All rabbit pellets are not equal and to make a blanket statement they are "bad" and cause fat is not true. Nutrena is low in both protein and fat.

Crude Protein Min. 16%
Crude Fat Min. 2.5%
Crude Fiber Min. 16%/Max 18%
Calcium Min 1.0%/Max 1.5
Phosphorus Min 0.6%
Salt Min 1.0%/Max 1.5%
Sodium Min 0.24%/Max 0.6%
Vitamin A Min 3,000 IU/LB

 

[VolunteerChin22]

I haven't noticed any change in my production so far - had roughly the same numbers born over the last two years. I did notice an initial weight gain when I switched from tradition, but I find they eat more of the pellets though. rather than wasting them. Im also happy and won't switch unless I have a good reason to. I have a mill in town so I can't see shipping food when I can get it locally. I also don't like the idea should I run out or be unable to get some at a show that I am then in a bind versus just picking it up at the feed store.

 

[ticklechin]

This yellow fat has been bothering me, so after some digging around I found Vit E deficiency in animals can cause it, looking around at the chinchilla and rabbit pellets there is a big difference in the two, chinchillas need at least twice as much as rabbits. Something to think about.

 

[Spoof]

This yellow fat has been bothering me, so after some digging around I found Vit E deficiency in animals can cause it, looking around at the chinchilla and rabbit pellets there is a big difference in the two, chinchillas need at least twice as much as rabbits. Something to think about.

Thanks Dawn!

I was wondering about that, I had fed that feed for several years and pelted a few chins and never saw the fatty layer. Also had a half dozen necropsied and they did not contain it. I did hear about it when talking about pelt qualities with Helen Colby and I wish I could remember what she said about it. Articles can say one thing, but a test environment with a few chins vs. a large working herd does make a difference.

During that time I provided a loose alfalfa and timothy mix and at one point had a bad experience trying calf manna. I wonder if that was what made the difference in absorption?

 

[EMSChins]

Curious as to what your bad experience with calf manna was as that is suggested in several places as an ingredient in supplement.

 

[Spoof]

I suppose I was lucky and just had a wave of random deaths and few babies born.

Jeff had a 22% survival rate on his babies using it and only lost one adult. The babies were huge, 65+g even for multiples but were born dead or died within the first day.

We split a bag and it took us a year to use it. I ended up throwing mine out after the sixth unknown death about eight months in. He finished his.

We fed the same stuff, were on the same water, once we stopped using it the issues stopped.

Just have to remember calf manna may not be the culprit itself but in combination with one random unknown thing can be a big problem.

 

[ticklechin]

So did some more digging, and looking at the meat rabbit forums they complain about yellow fat-the cause evidently is that some of the rabbit show formulas use soybean oil for fat that is lacking in vitamin E instead of nut based oil which has vit E and the sythetic vit E that is added is not enough. Interesting stuff, thanks Mark for sharing your info.

 

[EMSChins]

Hmmm...I started using supplement last year and calf manna is a very small percentage of the ingredient list. Out of 18 babies born so far this year I am at a 25% mortality rate for kits and have had one mother die so far. In the last two years my mortality rate has been less than 5% for kits and no adult deaths. I had already decided to stop the supplement as that has been the only change in my husbandry and ranch practices. I can't say that my kits have been any bigger but something is definitely different.

 

[ticklechin]

I have heard bad things about manna and breeding over the years, big kits and lots of deaths.

 

[jags]

One thing to remember if you are basing the quality of your feed on the tag analysis is that they only give you minimums and maximums, what the levels really are would sometimes really surprize you. I have had feeds tested for the real analysis and found feeds that claim a minimum of 16% that had as high as 24% protein. Also found out a large part of that protein was not usable by the animals, but was more cost effective. About the only thing I find use full on the tag is the mill date after all the testing, research and talks with feed nutrition people I have had dealings with.

 

[Kylelemler]

When we were using significant amounts of calf mana we were encountering larger death rates of kits and birthing moms. It seemed to make the kits too large to be birthed.

 

[EMSChins]

I haven't seen a statistically significant increase in the birth weights of the kits that have died which is why I didn't question the supplement at first and pull it sooner. In fact in the multiple birth litters it is typically the smaller of the kits that die and the kits are generally in the high 40's to mid 50's gm range which is an average size for me. For example, last week I had a litter of twins, one was 55 gms and the other was 63, the one that weighed 55 died within 24 hours. I have had 5 deaths like that this year so the supplement has been pulled as like I said, it is the only difference in my program. I can't say that I have noticed any difference in my breeders, kits or show string on the supplement so really see no reason for the added expense at this point - especially if it is the cause of the increased mortality rate of my kits. Just vack to good old basics of good clean water, high quality feed and hay and fresh air!

 

[mark miller]

Here is the analysis of our feed. Because we have our own formula of ingredients we are able to slightly change amounts with input from our feed nutritionalist. We tell the mill exactly how many pounds to use of each ingredient and know exactly what is being put into our feed and how much. This allows us to get the same levels of all our ingredients in every ton of feed we have milled. This keeps our analysis as close to the same as possible in every batch of feed we get.

Currently this is my milled chinchilla pellet analysis:

Protein 18%

Fat 3.5%

Fiber 19%

Phosphate .4%

Calcium 1.25%

I also feed loose prairie hay once a week to all my animals.