Advice/Information Needed, malo chin

[GlassOnion24]

Hello,

I brought my guy Darwin into the Vet 11 days ago and did not receive good news. I told the vet that I noticed some slight drooling for the past month under his chin so she took some x-rays and found the beginning stages of root elongation. Needless to say, I was devastated and it took everything I had to not break down right in the Vet's office.

Well anyway, she prescribed .15 mL of metacam once daily for 10 days, and then every other day for life. Along with, .15 mL regulan twice daily for life. Well, today is the 11th day but now Darwin seems to be drooling and pawing at his mouth more than he use to and I thought she said that the metacam would stop the drooling. Is the metacam helping him? I'm kind of scared to start going every other day with it. Is there another kind of pain medication that would work better?

Everything else is going great with Darwin. He still eats and chews on things, he goes crazy when I shake his treat bag and runs, jumps, and explores all over the place when I let him out for his play time. He even loves his medicine, he gets excited when he sees me get the syringe.

Also, how fast does the progression of root elongation go? Is it different for different chins? I know this is a long shot but - are there any cases of chins whose teeth stop growing down?

 

[mishellyshel]

the metacam is for the pain, it will not necessarily stop the drooling. did the vet notice any tooth spurs or uneven tooth growth? that is what often causes the drooling.

i have a chin with malo. he was dianosed in spring of 09, he gets semi regular filings. in the beginnig he had to have a few, his last one last year was in august and this year i just took him in july. he really didnt need much of a file but while i was there and he was under, she evened out what needed to be done.

i also needed to get a filing in july & august of last year because one spur was missed.
often when they do the filing, they prescribe a mild antibiotic like tri meth sulfa. the chins like the taste and it doenst affect their appetite like baytril might. they do this incase any of the teeth caused an abrasion on the gums or in the mouth somewhere.

there are a few of us here who have chins with malo. i dont think the roots ever stop growing and the rate at which they grow is chin to chin. however, i think they can be slowed down and you could still have darwin around for a while.

maybe you can get a copy of the xrays and post the results. there are many members here who have an excellant eye for root elongation (i am not one of them!) and perhaps you can get some opionions. in the end you need to do what works for you and the best interest of darwin. the fact that he is eating and chomping on wood is good. drooling is not, so i would look further into that.

i had to take richie to the vet 3 or 4 times before we got it straightend out. yes it cost me bunches, but it was worth it because a year & 1/2 later he is still with me.

i do have him on long term pain meds in conjuction with stomach stuff to make sure he is okay, i also do handfeed him daily as a supplement mostly because we are both so used to it, it is more like habit. he does eat some pellets. but every time i pull the syringe feeding even for a day, he goes in to a mild for of GI stasis and its a pain to get him back on track. its a lot of work to keep a malo chin going, but if you have the time, money & dedication..........darwin could thrive as long as he is comfortable. once the roots start growing close to the eye socket and you get watery eyes, the pain at that point is usually not manageable and it is time to let go.

 

[ticklechin]

Did the vet do a oral exam under gas? How old is he? Malocclusion and elongation usually go hand in hand but not every time. Elongation is painful and there is no cure. I have never had a drooling chin stop when given metecam if there was a mouth issue still in play, they would not stop even with a opioid pain killer. Metecam will help out the disposition of the chin in my experience. How is his weight, has it been consistant? Does he eat a treat readily if given? Are you hand feeding to supplement what he is eating on his own? I never give a motility drug (reglan) to a dental chin since I feed them and make sure they are getting the right amount of food a day so there is no need for it.

 

[GlassOnion24]

Thanks for the info

The Vet did do an oral exam an x-ray under gas. She said that his teeth are perfectly even on top, no spurs or points. So that shows he is chewing and keeping those filed down. All she found was the beginning of root elongation, you can feel a couple of small bumps under his jaw where it should be flat.

But yes, Darwin very readily accepts his treat every night and I see him munching on his pellets at his food bowl too. So I haven't been doing any hand feeding. The vet didn't say anything about his weight being a problem, my check out sheet said that he is 511g and I haven't noticed any significant weight changes since I have owned him. (He is about 5 to 6 years old, I've only had him for 1.5 years because I got him from a friend who was moving to another state).

 

[tunes]

There's no way to predict how fast his roots will grow, you'll just need to monitor him. When he starts losing weight, stops wanting to eat, when he turns down his favorite treat, and starts losing his "chinness" (playing, jumping, etc.), then you'll have a decision to make. As Dawn said, there is no cure for malo, and there really is no treatment for root elongation. So for now, enjoy him as much as you can, spoil him, and just wait and see how it goes.

 

[ticklechin]

If the chin has bumps along the jaw bone that are able to be felt, this chin has at least moderate elongation if not more advanced if the bumps feel like this picture looks-see the one tooth that is poking through? That is very painful and the metacam won't help help much, I would ask for tramadol. Also, if you are going to use the metecam or the tramadol for the rest of the chins life daily you need to use it with famotidine (Pepcid), ask the vet to get you the dose. NSAID's can cause ulcerations of the digestive tract with long term use. Elongation has no cure, no way to slow it down and is fatal, so please if you are going to go ahead with treatment keep in mind quality of life.

 

[GlassOnion24]

I will call my vet again and ask about a higher prescription or something. She said she was going to call me a few days after my visit to see how things are going and she never did. Which kind of peeves me off, especially since I also paid for a blood test which I don't have the results of.

But just now Darwin did something that kind of freaked me out. Ever since he was diagnosed with this, every movement he makes towards his mouth freaks me out. I gave him his Reglan and was about to grab his nightly treat when he opened his mouth and kind of moved his jaw around for a couple of seconds and then did a half sneeze before closing his mouth. But then he still really wanted his treat and he grabbed it and ran off to eat it.

I don't know if he has a super high pain tolerance or what but his chinny behavior hasn't changed a bit. And yes, I can feel two small bumps, I wish I could post the x-rays but she didn't give me a copy. And she prescribed the Reglan to prevent ulcerations and such.

I only have two vets in my area (MN -Twin Cities area) that I know of that have knowledge of chinchillas. My first vet bill was $189 so I don't know if I can afford to get a second opinion and re-pay for x-rays and the whole she-bang so soon again. I just want to do what's best for him and it's just hard to accept that his life is going to be cut so short when he acts as happy, normal, and spunky as ever. :cry3:

 

[ticklechin]

Reglan is a agressive way to treat the ulcerations, since it is a motility drug also. Pepcid is more benign way of dealing with it-its widley used in the rabbit world for long term pain managment. The motion you are talking about is typical malo, the chin during mouth movement hit a sore spot and that is the pain response.

The two bumps you speak of, in the picture above-are they bilateral? Are they located towards the incisors or towards the back of the mouth near the curve of the jaw at the hinge? This chin is not acting like a elongation pain chin nor a malo chin, its acting like a chin with a point and chin with points are not in constant pain, just when eating. It is often that vets miss points, especially the rear cheek teeth since that is where the drool pools, even my very experienced vet dentist has missed them.

 

[Sandi]

I wish I could post the x-rays but she didn't give me a copy.

If they cannot give you a copy of the xray, ask if you could come in and take pics of the xray with your digital camera. Have them put the xrays up on the light box. Take several pics to make sure you get at least one or two clear shots, use the macro setting on your camera sometimes setting it on automatic will be good enough. Then post them here.

Here are a few vets in the Twin cities area in case you decide to go to a different vet. -

http://chins-n-hedgies.com/forums/showthread.php?t=605

 

[GlassOnion24]

The two bumps you speak of, in the picture above-are they bilateral? Are they located towards the incisors or towards the back of the mouth near the curve of the jaw at the hinge?

The bumps are not bilateral, I can feel two small bumps on the left side toward the back of the mouth.

I think I will bring him to the Como Park Vet and see what they find and suggest. Do you think I would be able to get his x-rays sent from my other vet to the new one? Those things are so expensive I'm also starting to get low on his prescription and that way I can maybe get a different medicine...

About 8 years ago I would bring my guinea pig to this Vet (Cedar Pet Clinic). They seem very knowledgable, but the last time I took my guinea pig there, she was about 5 years old and was not eating or drinking. They gave me some medicine and told me that she would probably die within a month or two. Well, I syringe fed her baby food and water for about a month and she was perfectly fine, and lived to be 9 years old. I know it's different if a chin has root elongation, because that can't be fixed. But it just goes to show how wrong Vets can be about some things.

 

[ticklechin]

When you make the appointment at the new vet to request the x-rays from the old vet. Chinchillas its sad to say sometimes need second opinions since vets are not usually well versed on their issues. I still think you are dealing with points and not elongation, JMO based of your description of his attitude and symptoms.