Newbie with lots of Q's :~)

[Lucy~Caitlyn]

Hi,
I found this amazing looking site when I was trying to find out if fleece is safe for Chinchillas.
I live in the UK and have researched as much as I can about Chins, one problem is the conflicting advice :banghead:
My plan is to have 2 Chinchilla as I know they live in large groups. I tried for rescue but none available :cry3:
I've bought this cage and wheel for them AVENTURA Tall ALL METAL CHEWPROOF Rat Ferret Chinchilla Degu Large Cage 1152http://r.ebay.com/ERbCSA
NEW All Metal Large 28cm Degu, Rat, Chinchilla Wheel FREE PP http://r.ebay.com/liBMrL
Would really appreciate feedback on both, though fingers crossed you don't tell me to ditch the cage :hair:
I'm about to set it up but would appreciate some advice on whether I'm on the right track with my ideas.
I plan to cover the ladders in tight fitting fleece covers to protect toes and legs when racing up and down.
I have organic Hyacinth and Sisal mat and a Seagrass mat for the shelves.
Substrate for other floors I'm thinking of this 10kg Single Bale Fitch Paper Bedding For Smaller Critters
I do pottery at Adult Ed and plan to make them a "mountain range" to go on the base of the cage.
It would look like half coconut shells (though bigger, to accommodate an adult Chinchilla or 2.) most turned so that opening is on base.
There would be entrance (sometimes exit as well) and ventilation holes right across the top.
Some shells would be placed so that they are like bowls.
Shells joined together, including piled on top of each other but leaving nooks and crannies.
All glazed in Human safe glaze that can go in microwave/dishwasher.
I'd hide some of their food in different nooks and crannies, maybe even have special slits in roof of caves to put some food and hay tufts.
I want to enrich their play environment as though they were in the wild as far as possible.
I've some beautifully shaped large stones that my late SO and I collected in England and Scotland and I wondered about using these too or instead off?
I am planning on making their houses in pottery class too, I thought 1 each plus one big enough to share. Again ventilation holes all around. These would be secured in several places to the cage bars to prevent being hurled to the floor.
I have a variety of safe balls, small shapes that can be safely thrown around. Safe wood disks, logs and sticks of varying thickness in a variety of woods.
Fish bowl for dust bath which would be in playpen area to encourage return to cage.
Wooden parrot toys of safe wood with bells (checked regularly for safety). No ladders or swings don't want to risk toes or falls.
Thick knotted cotton rope dog chew toys as bridges with fleece hammocks below in case of falls.
Playpen area I've proofed my living room and have folded up metal dog crate covered with very thick cardboard to limit some areas.
10 mins before end of time would put fish bowls in a children's inflatable paddling pool (fleece on base). This would contain sand and start limiting their area of freedom ready for transition to cage and supper.
Food wise I'm thinking pre mixed Chinchilla pellets and mixture of hay until 1 year old and then over 3 months introduce:~
Rolled barley with dried raspberry 1/4 tsp 1x1 a week (this cleans rodents blood, prevents kidney problems and strengthens/stimulates digestive tract & boosts immune system)
Lucerne linseed pellets 1x2 a week (good for fur and high fibre.)
Beetroot pellets 1x1 a week (improves colon activity).
Herbal nuggets Alfalfa with linseed binding, wheat, mint, rosemary and oregano. As a treat if other food eaten
Degu Dazzle beetroot chips, carrot flake, tomato flake and seeds, leek flake, milk thistle seeds, buckwheat, astragalus root, flat peas, millet heads,
organic toasted flakes, norfolk oats and barley. 1/4 teaspoon every other day.
Carousel Mix butternut bark, liquorice root, lemongrass, yellow peppers, uva ursi leaves,
meadowsweet, luci chop, nettle root, nettle leaves, fennel seeds, hemp seeds, organic jumbo oats 1x a week.
Dried Hibiscus flower good for blood pressure and calms the nerves. This is part of my medicine cabinet if there has been stress.(works for people too)
Purple Marshmallow flowers, loved by small furries and great for tummy problems (works for people too)
Whoops, sorry it's such a long post, I just really want to be sure everything is as perfect as possible before the kits are even booked.
I believe doing it this way I can hopefully iron out issues before they are a problem. Many thanks for reading this.
Not relevant to their welfare but little ones will have names from Native language spoken in Peru, as near as possible to time of the Inca.

 

[Amethyst]

The cage looks like it would work great, it even has metal pans which is a huge plus. The wheel however is too small and dangerous, you need a wheel at least 15" or 38cm, and that wheel is also dangerous because a leg, foot, tail, or even neck can get caught between the side bars and snapped off.

The bedding you generally want is wood shavings (kiln dried pine or aspen) or fleece liners (fleece is only safe if it's not chewed), most paper bedding expands when wet which will cause a blockage if eaten.

Chins don't need ramps, they are hoppers not walkers so it's safer and easier to just remove them all together. You can add wood perches though, they help with preventing feet problems too since flat surfaces are unnatural. I don't see any issue with using stones so long as they are properly sterilized and they aren't somewhere they can be pushed off. Stone tiles are commonly used to give the chin a cool place to sit. The mountain range sounds awesome, I'm sure they will love that.

No cotton rope, it will cause a blockage if eaten, stick to digestible rope like sisal, sea grass, or coconut. Also make sure the wood is chin safe, parrot/bird safe doesn't always equal chin safe.

For food all you want is plain alfalfa or timothy based pellets (no junk food mixed in) and hay, hopefully someone in the UK can help with brands. Chins are strict grass herbivores and should not have fruit, vegetables, nuts, seeds, animal products (dairy, eggs, hide, bone, shells, or meat), or anything with sugar.
Safe treats include things like, plain cheerios, shredded wheat, old fashion oats, rose hips, and rose blossoms/peddles, as well as some dried herbs (you may have listed some ok herbs but I don't personally feed herbs so I can't help there). Treats (anything other then the pellets and hay) should be fed at most one treat a day, but ideally a couple times a week or less.
I wouldn't hide the pellets around, they might get lost, peed on, and it will make it harder to keep track of how much they are eating, but the hay around different places is good. Pellets should make up roughly 25% with hay making up the other 75% of their diet.

Also if you are getting kits they shouldn't be giving out of cage playtime or a wheel until at least 6 months, they don't tend to know how to pace themselves which can cause over heating, low blood sugar, seizures, and death. They also shouldn't be given treats until they are 6 months or so either since they need to be eating good food for growing not treats. Also talking about play areas, a kit can get through 1/2" (1.27cm) bar spacing and an adult can get though anything bigger then 1" (2.54cm) spacing, so the dog crate might not work unless it has tighter bar spacing then most I've seen. Or maybe I'm misunderstanding how you are using them? I'm also not sure about that inflatable pool idea, a chin would probably bite it and pop it, also chins can easily jump 5 feet, so a small pool isn't going to contain them.

Another thing to keep in mind is that it does happen sometimes that even bonded pairs can decide they don't like each other and may need to be separated, even years down the road. Chins can and often do fight to the death so take any fighting that causes fur slips, or especially blood, very seriously (blood drawn is normally an indication of intent to kill). So you do want to make sure you have the ability to separately cage as many chins as you have if need be. Also if one chin gets sick or hurt a separate cage might be needed temporally too.

A few things you didn't mention that you will probably want to buy are, a gram scale to weigh them (they weigh so little, grams are the best measurement), an ac unit (chins need temps below 25C and below 50% humidity), also a thermometer for the room that measures temp and humidity. A travel cage or carrier can also be useful too for emergencies or vet visits.

 

[Lucy~Caitlyn]

Amethyst, thank you :~)
As soon as I unpacked the wheel yesterday I had doubts so thanks for confirming that.
I'm going to ask someone I know who has organic apple trees to let me have some pieces
to make into shelves. Will also use kiln dried regular shelves. I think it's really important for all creatures to have a variety of surfaces to walk on.
The rocks are too heavy for Chins to move and would only be on the bottom of the cage. I thought steam clean them? Possibly bake in oven for couple of hours at high temp?
Thanks for the tip on not hiding pellets, I was concerned about boredom and I would like to encourage them to use the skills of their ancestors. But their safety is vital so I'll just use hay or Chinchilla/Parrot safe toys.
Thanks to for the warning about the cotton rope dog toys, I'd seen these used in Chin cage set ups and thought they were safe :~(
Is it okay to use Sisal? I was going to string different wood chews together and hang them so they could be reached by stretching up or sitting on mountain.
I don't have cereal other than oats as I don't believe in giving any creature (including me) sweet things as it's addictive and empty calories, I know shredded wheat doesn't have sugar but as I have dietry issues of my own I don't have this.
The herbs I've listed come from chinchillas2shop.co.uk this is where I got toys and wood chews too. I was going to use rosehips/herbs as a training treat.
Play area~ I'm going to use my living room as I can put cats in their own room during playtime.
Due to the lousy design of my flat my living room looks like a corridor. Window at each end and two doors on each side wall, one at each end.
Because of my mobility issues I keep the furniture against the walls, one window is a bay with built in storage and seating, the other window has a radiator with a table in front of it.
I plan to use my folded dog crates (with the cardboard that came of the cages covering the crates) to block off the end of the room where the table is. I know they can jump over it, but I'll be in the room (on the only chair) and I will clap my hands if they get too close to the barrier.
The inflatable pool is not so much about keeping them in as about making a routine. Tear up and down open 9' area, leap on and off bay window seating, they will have cardboard tunnels from inside carpets.
When playtime is coming to an end I'll put out pool with dust baths in it. The hope is that they will then hop in for a bath. Space is more enclosed than play area and is transition to back to cage. I don't want to go from open space to cage, hence the transition of the pool. Again they won't be unsupervised so hopefully I can distract biting.
I would limit baby playtime, I've yet to find any creature that doesn't over exert as a little one :~) that said I'll not do any playtime until 6 months and then build up slowly from a confined play area that enlarges until freedom of the room when they are ready.
I've proofed my wires (one of my cats chews wires!) and I will make sure there is nothing out that can be harmful. Nothing can be knocked over because my cats are convinced they too are Chinchillas and jump in the air as though they are on trampolines. They use the middle of the room and bay window as a race circuit which is why I thought it ideal for Chins play area.

Is AC an air conditioner? I have one because of my health issues same goes for thermometer as I'm a bit like a Chinchilla myself in that respect :~)
I have a wired cat carrier that I was given for my cats but never used as I already had carriers they new. I was thinking of making a to go over it, so they've got privacy and feel safer.
I have scales from weighing my birds of prey (before disability progressed I flew them which meant daily weighing) also I can adjust to weigh from a mouse to a cat.
I still have a cupboard given over to emergency rescue of small creatures :~) last week I found a baby field mouse on my doorstep, left by a neighbours cat. Popped it in my hospital tank and 24 hours later I was able to set it free.
I have a fold down dog crate (takes a labrador) which I use if anyone in family (except hamster) needs separating temporarily, would this do? I could keep wooden shelves ready to attach. Also every inch is steam cleaned after every use.
Reading your comments about even bonded pairs having the potential to end up divorcing I'm in a quandary.
I believe that unless a creature is naturally solitary (with allowances for individual hermit preferences in grouping creatures) that they should have at least one member of their own species with them.
I can spend a large amount of time with my Chin as I would be out only during Chin's sleep time. Max I would be away from home is 6 hours at a time and that is limited to once a fortnight and 4.5 hours a week during term time. I'm still not there 24/7/365(6) though.
Thanks again for the answers you have given, sorry for the new questions though.
I just want to make as few mistakes as possible.

 

[KrystalTears]

Hello!
Welcome to chin parenthood!

Fleece is a safe alternative to bedding. Just make sure you check it regularly for holes and replace it if you find your chinchilla has chewed a hole through it since you do not want your little fuzzy to eat it or get his foot caught. From what I have seen, they typically do not eat it. I personally do not use fleece but I know plenty of people that do so. I use the Oxbow bedding for my chin since he refuses to be potty trained (he pees in all four corners of his cage and putting four litter boxes in there would take up all his floor space). Two chinchillas is an excellent idea since you can ensure that your little ones have a friend with them all the time when you are away. But please know that it is not always necessary to have a pair together. Also, keep in mind that two chinchillas can suddenly disagree with one another.
I had a pair of males that got along for many years (one establishing his dominance by mounting the other periodically) and one day the dominant male (Kyo, homozygous beige) attacked the submissive male (Nobu, standard). Kyo drew blood on Nobu and never got along with Nobu again. Once they fight, you cannot keep them together again. I had to rehome Kyo since he was antagonizing Nobu so much to the point where Nobu stopped eating. I had no other safe place in my home to place Kyo. Originally, I had another room to put him into should that happen, but we moved into a much smaller house and I could not afford to move. They were the best of friends for 7 years. I am not telling you to scare you. I am just telling my story so then you can see that no matter how long they have been together, chinchillas will not always be so accepting of cagemates and may try to kill them. If you get two males, you might want to consider getting them neutered since I was told by my vet that may have stopped Kyo from attacking. But he was afraid to perform the surgery on Kyo since he was pretty old at the time.
Please do not purchase that wheel for your chinchilla, it is unsafe and too small for them. If you wish to purchase a wheel for them, here are some links to some websites that sell safe wheels for chinchillas:
http://www.flyingsaucerwheels.com/products.php?cat=17
http://www.exoticnutrition.com/trwhla14in.html
These wheels are pricey, but I hear that they are worth it. I tried to get my chinchilla to use a wheel but he will not. It is hard teaching an old dog new tricks.
You do not need ladders, as Amethyst stated. They are jumpers so ladders are unnecessary. I honestly do not know why manufacturers make ladders for chinchillas (even the cage I have is just for chinchillas and it came with ladders). But anyways! I have never purchased that type of litter before since they appear to only sell Oxbow & CareFRESH litter in the US. It sounds like you will be able to make them some awesome cage accessories. That sounds like a wonderful way to keep their mind stimulated!
So long as the stones do not have any sharp corners, chinchillas should be fine with them. You might want to also consider getting some tile or a piece of granite in the cage to help keep them cool. Please post a picture of the house when you make it! We would love to see it.
I would agree with Amethyst that not all parrot safe woods are equivalent to chinchilla safe woods. I would suggest checking out the forum for safe woods. Here are a few forum posts on here stating what wood is safe and unsafe.
http://www.chins-n-hedgies.com/forums/showthread.php?t=45846
http://www.chins-n-hedgies.com/forums/showthread.php?t=25564
Please stay away from cotton, for you want natural digestible ropes like sisal. Do you plan on getting kits or older chinchillas? I am not sure how you acquire chinchillas in the UK, but here in the US there are pet stores that sell kits that are full size. If you do get kits, I do not believe that the dog crate would be good since they can squeeze between ½” bars. Also, kits tend to be really excitable and do not know when to stop playing when exploring out of the cage. This can be dangerous since they can overheat. When I had my second chinchilla, he was a small kit. I felt bad whenever I would let Nobu out and not him. So what I ended up doing (until he got bigger of course) was to put him in a large cardboard box and let him run around in there for a little while to allow him to have some out of cage time.
As for pellets, I tend to feed my chinchilla Oxbow. I hear that Mazuri is also a good food. If you can get any of these brands, please do! Also, chinchillas are not like other rodents when it comes to freeze dried fruits. You could give a little freeze dried raspberry as a treat, but I would not keep it in their food. It is best to keep their pellets without other freeze dried vegetables since their diet is very limited. I give my chinchilla rose hips as a treat 1-3 times a day. It is very useful in keeping his teeth filed down since he refuses to eat hay. Not to mention that it has Vitamin C, which helps boosts your chinchilla’s immune system. Hay is important for dental health as well as making sure they get enough fiber. They should have access to hay 24/7 and pellets 24/7 as kits. Once they get older, the pellets should be given in 1/8 cup to ¼ cup a day. However, my chinchilla refuses to eat hay so I have to give him more pellets.
If you want a list of safe treats, here is a link to another forum in this website:
http://www.chins-n-hedgies.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28700
It is definitely best to purchase and/or make everything before you bring your little ones home! I learned that mistake the hard way since I purchased my first chinchilla and his cage at the same time. I had to buy 3 cages due to not preparing properly for him. I think it would be cute to name them Peruvian names.
Once again, welcome to Chinsn’Hedgies!
-KrystalTears

P.S. if you want to learn more about chinchillas, there is one book that I do recommend. It helped me better understand my chinchilla when I got him. Chinchillas (A Complete Pet Owner’s Manual) by Barron’s. Though it is a bit out of date (2009), it does give you some useful information when it comes to chinchilla health and other related information.

 

[Cass C]

I just wanted to add chinchillas don't need another chinchilla to be happy. They can happily live alone. To increase your chance of sucess with pairs try to get two that are already bonded and plan on having 2 of everything that could be a 'resource' such as food dishes, water bottles, hay feeders, and possibly houses/hammocks.

 

[Amethyst]

You still need to properly prepare any fresh tree wood you get, scrub and bake it. You will also want twigs and sticks too from the apple tree, chins love them. Baking the rocks should work too.

I mentioned the cereal since it's cheap and easy for most people to get, obviously healthy natural food is better. Chins really don't need treats though, it's nice but chins do have the ability to survive on just hay. Pellets don't make up for lack of hay as it sounds like KristalTears is doing, they need the long stand fiber for proper digestion as well as to properly wear down their teeth (they need to chew a lot). Without the hay you will run into teeth problems especially since pellets are highly nutritional which makes teeth grow more then in the wild (where their diet is poor). Pellets are also crushed between teeth and do nothing to wear them down, rosehips are treats and also don't work to replace hay since you can't give them that much. If the chin doesn't like the hay provided fine on it will eat, mixed kinds tend to work the best for picky chins.

With using the sisal rope for toys keep in mind that chins like to chew through the rope, so the toy will fall apart. For more permanent toy base you can use wire (haywire, or even jewelry wire work) or stainless steel kabob style holders or chains (like these), just make sure they are steel, brass, or nickle, not zinc, which is toxic.

I'm not sure a dog crate will work for temporary housing, unless the bar spacing for the crate are less then an inch (2.5cm) otherwise the chin can get out. I know it's hard to accept the chins being alone, but remember in the wild if they don't like each other they have the whole rest of the area to get away, in a home they are in a cage. I have had chins that enjoy playmates but not cage mates too though, so just because they don't want to live together doesn't always mean they don't want a friend. They had cages near each other so they can see, talk, and smell another chin.
As said a prebonded pair is best especially for a new chin owner wanting two (no need to do intros and bonding), and two of everything to prevent fighting over resources. You also want a big cage to allow them to get away from each other if needed (the cage you got is good). Just think living with a room mate, you will have a better chance of getting along better if you have your own stuff and own rooms/area to retreat to.

I'm still unsure how well your idea of the pool will work, chins are smart and will probably catch on to the pool = playtime ending pretty quick. It's worth a try but don't count on it. Yes, AC is air conditioner, I also prefer cold, it really does make it nice to prefer the same temp as the animals living with you.

I'm not sure about that supply site you linked, most of the treats listed are not good for chins. To get a better idea of good herbs check out Fuzzies Kingdom she has actually done research for appropriate herbs for chins, it's a US site but should give you a better idea of what to get and how much. You could check the list on that UK site with the Fuzzies Kingdom site to make sure you get the right/safe stuff. That site also has a foraging hay mix that apparently chins go nuts over, I haven't bought it myself as I live in Canada, but it sells out quick.

 

[IceMaiden]

Hi Lucy,

First up the cage you've got is great, perfect for Chins as it's all metal. The only downside to it is only two doors open, which makes access a bit trickier than a cage with four fully opening doors, but other than that, it's an excellent cage with a great write up.

As treats, I get Aldi's shredded wheat which is really cheap, and give her a tiny pinch or put it in with her food. As I also have a hamster, she also gets one of the sunflower seeds out of the mix as a luxury, by that I mean one seed perhaps every two weeks or so as too many are not good.

For food I use Science Selective chinchilla pellets, as they have a good percentage of fibre (19%) compared to most other foods. You won't get Oxbow over here, at least not for a reasonable price! It is extortionately priced as its imported in, think around the £30 mark for 2kg for pellets and around £15 for a bag of hay!! Charnwood chinchilla pellets are very good too, but their normally for breeders as they come in a 20kg sack, and even the smaller 5kg one is likely to have got stale before the average pet owner could use it up on one or two chins.

Haywise, you've got The Hay Experts, Burns make a green oat hay and a Welsh meadow hay, Burgess do a herbal forage hay mix, Pets AtHome have their own range of meadow and Timothy hay, and Wilko's also do a good Timothy hay for £2. Try and get a variety of different hays as each type is different and must be chewed in a different way which helps keep all the teeth worn down properly. Also, it will prevent them getting bored with it and stop eating it.

For chews, extra nutrition and toys check out Chinchillas2Shop, these are fantastic, they've got probably the largest range of chin safe chews and treats over here. Galen's Garden is another one to look up and you won't go wrong with anything in the Rosewood's boredom breakers Naturals range, who do a super choice of healthy grasses, plants and herbs, all clearly labelled on what small pet their suitable for, so you can see instantly if it's ok for chins.

Finally unless you want to sew your own, Fuzzbutt and Hammocky Hammocks are the places to go to for any fleece accessories, and I believe HH make cage liners to order as well.

 

[Lucy~Caitlyn]

Hi Krystal Tears, Thanks for the welcome :~). I appreciated your telling me about your 2 Chinchilla's divorcing :~( I really need as much info as possible good and bad if I'm to be the best parent I can be.
I'm def not getting that wheel! I've found a man in UK who makes the Flying Saucers himself. He charges £40 which is half the cheapest I've seen but I'm going to ask for prev customers to give me feedback. I know he could fake it but I have to start somewhere and expensive doesn't mean best.
I'm going to get my kits from a breeder but via a pet shop. The breeder only deals with the pet shop, when kits are born I'll be told, then given a choice of colours (I'm first on the list for the next litter) and put down a deposit. Then when old enough to leave Mum they go to pet shop. I'll be told when they are due and can pick them up as they arrive or when I'm ready. As mine are booked they won't be on display if I can't be there straight away. Which of course I'll move Heaven and Earth to do :~)
I plan to offer mixed hays and hay pellets in case they are fussy :~) and to help my breathing if hay is dusty. Though I'll look for dust free for them too.
Thanks for book idea. I have An Essential Guide to owning a Chinchilla by Mirella Poli plus a book of hers about Natural health care, only for small things not instead of a good vet. I'll check your book too.
I've found that by checking the same info in a variety of places I'm getting a better grasp of the correct info. I hope!

 

[Lucy~Caitlyn]

Hi Cass, Thank you, I planned on 3 of everything :~) 2 single size & 1 double! I am working on the principle that each Chin needs it's own stuff, then that whatever the other one has looks better so they'll check that out and having a larger version means easier sharing too.
Thanks for letting me know pairs aren't vital. Though if it is two they'll be from the same litter/

 

[Lucy~Caitlyn]

Amethyst Hi again. I'll absolutely treat the wood, I've been fortunate enough to have had the opportunity to rear many animals, birds and reptiles over the years and although I'm new to Chinchilla there are still similarities in some of my other creatures. I appreciate the reminder though :~)
I'll always supply a mixed hay and pellets along with fresh filtered water. Treats now I've weeded out the conflicting advice :~) will be just that, special treats.
I know they'll chew through the sisal, and I'll be sure falling toys can't hurt them :~) I'll check out your suggestions for more permanent toys too.
I'll only use my dog crates as barriers in play area, thanks for advice on that. I have a parrot cage with very small bars that I have had Sparrows, Baby Barn Owls (they can get through amazingly small gaps even as grown ups),Jays and rats in. I'll use this as emergency cage.
I'm sure my Chins will catch on to playtime ending very fast :~) A friend shares a Chin with her boyfriend and he has taught "Olly" that when he rings a bell then playtime is almost over. Olly then dives in dust bath until the BF picks up a towel then Olly climbs on his arm, gets loose dust off rolling in the towel and goes to bed. That's why I want to do my idea as soon as kits are old enough.
All the foodstuff I listed comes from what I'm assured is a reliable Chinchilla source, IceMaiden lists them in her reply to me. I did check their credentials thoroughly and 5 year Olly and his cousin (from same breeder) Jasper 9 both have what I listed. I will check out your links too and thanks for all your help and advice for my future FurBabies.

 

[Lucy~Caitlyn]

Hi IceMaiden, Put cage together today and can def see that 4 doors are easier:~) That said at £134 I can't quibble on something so big :~)
Thanks for heads up on Aldi cereal I'll have to see if my BIL has this :~) I have a hamster too (Grayling) but I haven't given her sunflower seeds. She's chewing a chicken bone as I write.
Thanks for the tips on food and hay, I've checked out my local Wilco's for hay as well as their small animals grooming kit, Grayling likes being brushed.
Where do you get Chinchilla dust? I'd prefer to go by recommendation.
I got all my food stuff/treat plans from Chinchillas2Shop and have already bought their assorted toy chew bag + some extras :~) I'll check out the other places too for variety.
Thanks for heads up on hammocks ect, I'll probably make my own as I trained many moons ago as a Naval Tailor in Portsmouth and it's good to keep my hand in :~) I've just made a fleece Chinchilla sling for a friend. Her BF carries his Chin on his shoulder around their home and has since he was a kit. My friend's not so confident having only been around for a year. Now she wears the sling and the minute Olly sees it he climbs in and she can safely walk around with him. He doesn't chew it and it has a little pocket that she puts hay or a pellet or 2 in for him.
Thanks for your help :~)

 

[Lucy~Caitlyn]

KrystalTears, meant to say I was considering neutering but have ready scary reports on Chins not surviving op. Where poss I have all my pets doctored to ensure no unwanted little ones.
Re the rocks, all have rounded off in the weather :~) I'm going to make ceramic slabs that I can pop in the freezer. I thought 6, 1 each + spare in use then 3 getting cool.
I'll take pics as soon as setup, though will have to do update as Chin Mountain will take a few weeks as I only do pottery for 2 hours a week.
Did get a seagrass cube today that I think will make a great house. When they demolish it I can redo it with Sisal, then Willow from my own willow trees that I know are safe. Though I'll still treat it because it is from outside.

 

[IceMaiden]

For sand I use the one in the white bag in pets at home for £4. Works out cheaper than Charlie chinchilla as you get more of it, but both are good. Get a cheap sieve, then you can sift the sand after use and it lasts far longer. I know your still wondering about 1 or 2 chins, but if you do go for two, you need a separate bath for each chin.

Be vary, vary careful if your considering neutering. Chins are still relatively rare and unknown as pets in the UK and many many vets will have no clue about them. The training they get in vet school might fleetingly cover chins but that's not in enough depth to really know about them, infact I'd bet most owners will know more about chins than the average vet does! Their classed as an exotic pet so you need either an exotics vet or one who specialises in chinchillas, especially for any kind of surgery.

Can I ask where you've found a flying saucer for £40? As that is extremely cheap, the only company in the UK who have metal saucer wheels are Shelfridges, and their £80-90? There are some on eBay who sell metal saucers usually made from a shallow dog bowl for around £40, but their for Degus and wouldn't be strong or big enough for a chin. If you've found a source for suitable cheap wheels that would be really great as there are barely any over here!

 

[Lucy~Caitlyn]

Hi IceMaiden, thanks for reply re sand and sieve, I do this with my cat's litter too saves a fortune :~). As to neutering have decided absolutely not! I appreciate your comments re vets and exotics. Having bred and flown raptors I know how hard it can be to get a vet who knows more than owner. Once had to go from Kent to Mousehole Cornwall to find a vet who was qualified in raptors and had same issue with goats as lived in a town not country.

If I do get 2 Chins I'll def get 2 baths. I got one today which I'm delighted with, it's stainless steel has a handle which makes storage easier and sits on 3 round feet. I'ts a really wide and deep bowl that 2 grown chins could get in, though I know it's one each.
I like the fact it gives them room to move about in it.

Re flying saucers I made contact with the person I was told about and turns out he says £40 to get people interested but is actually £80 grrrrrrr Sorry if I got your hopes up too.
Guess as kits will be too young initially I'll have to save up :~)

Could you give me your opinion on these for my setup please, Mega Pack Shelves,platforms.ladders Chinchilla,Degu,Rat Cage Furniture 9 items http://r.ebay.com/WULFn7 Two 6x4 http://r.ebay.com/inZaav Pack 5 Pine Shelves Ledges Rat, Chipmunk,Degu,Hamster Cage http://r.ebay.com/bYkrhN
it's not a case of money no object by any means but I do want to give my Chin(s) as much stimulation as possible so prepared to buy as many as will achieve that without overcrowding the cage. This would supplement metal levels already provided and my "Chin Mountain" and rocks.
I was thinking of wooden shelves stepped all around the cage, will try to site so that tv can be seen as well.

I have a natural sounds machine for me to relax with, rainstorm, birdsong, rainforest, seashore + do you think this would be worth having on quietly at night in place of tv on some nights?
Thanks for all your help

If only one Chin is it worth making a "Chin buddy" to cuddle up with? Would check regularly for damage.

 

[IceMaiden]

That is really sneaky, saying £40 just to get people interested . I imagine it works too, as they know full well people will jump at the chance of getting what is normally a really expensive wheel cheap! I did have an inkling, so I'm not that surprised, i'd have been more surprised if they really were that price to be honest! As they say, I f it sounds too good to be true it probably is.

Keep an eye out on ebay as they often come up second hand, and pick up only ones don't get as many bids as ones that will post. I got lucky and got one for £30 that had been relisted three times as it said strictly no postage, but I think they were just desperate to sell it by the end as they posted it when I asked, so it's always worth a try. If you want a 'standard' type wheel, you will almost certainly have to import one from the U.S., none of the very few over here are big enough for a chin, which is why I ended up getting a saucer for mine.

All three packs on those links are fine, though if you get the first, discard the wire ladder. That's for rats, chins don't need ladders and ramps as they hop about instead of walking. Everything else is great though if you want to get those, but just a small tip to save you some money: if you go to a builders/timber merchant you can get several feet of untreated pine shelf planking for less than those packs to make your own with. Most timber merchants will also be able to cut it to the lengths/shapes you want it if you ask them, then all you have to do is fix them in place with screws and washers. I paid about £12-15 in my builder's yard and got enough planking to make 6 shelves, 12 leap ledges and a hanging bridge toy, for a cage the exact same size as yours, so might be something worth bearing in mind.

You could try your sound machine, just make sure none of the sounds swish or make a hissing noise. Things that sound like a snake can scare them silly, my first chin used to act suddenly terrified if I went near her in a raincoat, which I eventually realised was due to the 'swishing' noise waterproofs make Provided the cage isn't right next to a telly that's on super loud, I don't think your chin will be bothered about the tv/radio. Mine isn't when she's running about the house and the radio's on in the background.

My girl hasn't got a cuddle buddy as I doubt she'd look at it, but some chins really love them. I believe Hammocky Hammocks make them, ( in the or you can make your own. Just sew two pieces of fleece into whatever shape you want and stuff it with more bits of fleece. I would make sure your chin isn't a fleece chewer first though, as chances are, if they chew hammocks or liners, their going to chew a fleece 'pillow' too.

Here is a photo of my cage setup to give you some ideas as it's the same size/style of cage:

 

[Lucy~Caitlyn]

Thanks for all your helpful advice IceMaiden, it's great knowing that as your in the UK you've got extra ideas on resources I really appreciate it.
I was pretty livid with the creep but Your right if it looks to good, it's probably suspect.
I'll keep watching ebay and try your idea even if it says no postage :~)
I'd thought about builders/wood merchants especially as I have one locally. I was put off because I know that I've deteriorated to far to be safe with a saw :~( I hadn't thought about asking them to cut for me, great idea ~ Thanks. I would have used the wire ladder in my miniature garden to grow tiny climbers on :~)
Oh, gosh I'd not thought about the swishing/hissing noise. I bet that's what's bothering my cats! I got a new full length waxed coat for Christmas. It's difficult to find the right coat for my wheelchair and this straps to my legs which then makes a noise when I move. For some reason my 3 Ragdoll/Siamese have been terrified of snakes since they opened their eyes. Toys, on tv or sound.
The tv thing came from reading someone who had and worked with rescuing Chins. They wrote that they saw a marked in improvement in Human/Chin sociability when tv left on low at night. I'm often awake in the night anyway but didn't want boredom creeping in.
I'll def make sure I don't have a fleece chewer before I make a "cuddle buddy" :~) I've got a great pattern for mouse/squirrel/rabbit that I scale down for little hands to hold or up and fill with sand as doorstops. Though recently been asked to fill with rice to warm in microwave for cold hands and lentils as juggling paper weight. Thought Mouse with big ears stuffed with fleece for Chin Kit.
Wow your cage set up is terrific! How thick are the shelves and are they regular washers?
Fleece instead of substrate would answer my issue about it being pushed through the gaps.
My hamster has removed all her bedding from the basement a lovely deep clear plastic area to her Penthouse a metal railed area with clear plastic roof. She's piled it all up against the bars and I woke to paper snow the first morning :~)
To her fury (I know because she shakes bars and grumbles at me) I've put cardboard around her nest on the outside :~)
I'll have to try and workout how to do photos of mine as I get it set up. I want to have a record of it for myself as well, so I can look back and see the changes :~)
Making my own shelves/ledges though not only saves me money but is so much more personal. I'll be sure to make sure all edges are sanded down and rounded off too.

 

[IceMaiden]

Your cuddle buddies sound great, if you can develop a chin shape I'm sure they'd go down well on here. There aren't too many toys specifically for chins available over here as their still quite an unusual pet for the most part. Lots of the toys sold for small animals aren't suitable for chins when you look at them closely.

The shelves in my cage are 5" wide and 1" deep. The washers are 1" ones so that they overlap the bars and can't pull through.

Is your hamster cage a Savic hamster heaven (light blue base dark blue bars) by any chance? Hamsters are notorious for clogging up the penthouse on the top of those wth bedding, so most people remove them.

To upload photos, click the down facing arrow next to the paper clip (on the top row of icons near where it says 'fonts' and 'sizes'. To opens a new window with the choice to upload 5 images. Click 'choose file', choose your picture the click 'upload' and a link should appear within a few seconds, something like 'img001.jpg'. This is your picture and should appear at the bottom of your post after you have sent it. The other way is to use an image uploader like photobucket.

If you buy pine designed for shelving you won't need to sand it, as its already sanded nice and smooth by machine. If it's rough looking/feeling, you haven't got untreated pine planking, but the rough sawn stuff normally used for outside projects where it doesn't have to look as tidy as the stuff you want in your house. Don't use it for your chin at all, this has been tannalised and pre-treated with preserver to weatherproof it, making it unsafe to chew on. You really don't need to spend time rounding the corners off, the chin will do that for you.

 

[Lucy~Caitlyn]

Thanks for the tip on wood for shelving, and the size and fittings, they'll def make a better job of sanding than I will :~)
I was thinking of jumping ledges 18" of floor and then 18" apart up and around cage in brickwork fashion (hope that makes sense) with a ledge or corner shelf (Wickes corner shelf without the brackets, thought these might work for chewing on) above and or below the existing metal shelves.
Planning on leaving 2' square play area on each floor under the metal shelves.
Being a first time Chin Mum is nerve wracking even before arrival :~)
I'm concerned that they can catch human viruses, I rarely have a cold goes straight to Bronchitis/Pleurasy and I do ask Support Workers with sniffles to stay away but any advice on keeping them safe if I'm not well?
How do you measure humidity? I have regular thermometers and an air conditioner from a couple of years ago when we had a sweltering hot Summer. My friend in NY is always talking about humidity levels but it goes over my head :~)
I'll work on a "Chin Cuddle Buddy" would you mind being one of my human/Chin testers when I've worked it out?
Grayling's cage is this one, 3 tier Large Hamster Gerbil Mouse Small Pet Cage Transparent Clear 2 or 3 Storey Levels http://r.ebay.com/Iowoev She's having a strop because I've replaced the cardboard that stops her pushing her bedding out with acetate so now I can see what she's up to :~)
I got her a mushroom bird house in Poundland, took the chain off to use for Chins and that she does seem to like. The vagaries of our pets :~)

 

[Lucy~Caitlyn]

Whoops meant to thank you for tips re photos. I'm actually further back than that, trying to work out how to get them from Kindle Fire I got for Christmas on to internet. All I know is they are stored in Amazon, would like to transfer to my laptop as that's what I use to email.
Peace here, all cats, dog and hamster fed, watered, exercised and peacefully sleeping a rare happening :~)

 

[Amethyst]

I'm not sure if I'm misreading that or not, but 18" apart is way too much space apart for ledges. You don't want any drop more then 12 inches otherwise the chin can get seriously injured or die. For a kit I would make sure to put ledges 6 inches or less apart, 6 inches is about good for an adult too. Also overlap any ledges so there is no way of falling more then a foot, kits like to climb the cage too so keep that in mind. This is an old Christmas thread (cage is a bit different now) but it gives you an idea of overlapping I'm talking about.

Just to clarify on the cuddle buddy (just making sure you have the right idea), it should be about the size of a chin, not just a tiny stuffy type thing. They are good for single chins to cuddle up with, and also for males to, umm, have their way with, (not sure how to phrase that politely).

As to the possibility of spreading anything to the chin when sick, you could wear a mask over your mouth and make sure to wash your hands before doing anything in the cage if you are sick. Just keep things to a minimum when sick, feed, water, and that's about it, playtime can wait till you are better, contrary to what the chin may believe. Being in the same room should be ok, so long as you aren't sneezing or coughing on them or near them.

I don't know why IceMaiden suggests one bath per chin, unless a chin is sick I don't see any reason for them to have individual baths, my two love bathing together. One per cage I can understand, but if they are in the same cage they already live together so anything one has the other will too. Even when I had about a dozen chins they all shared one bath tub of dust, just sieved between chins.

Oh and another thing with the nature sounds, my chins also freak if there is any birds of prey sounds too, not sure why that would be on a sound machine but just in case. I was bugging my cats with a bird app I have on my phone and played a type of hawk I think and the chins freaked out bolting around the cage and alarm calling.