Accidental Breedings

[Stackie]

I'm having a hard time understanding exactly what "accidental breeding" means. If a male and a female are together at any point in time, then the possibility for breeding exists. Unless you are delusional, there is no way that you can say that there was an accidental breeding. An accidental breeding is a male escapes and gets into a females cage, or a female escapes and a male escapes and they run around together. An accidental breeding is ignorance shown by a pet store where they put males and females together because they don't bother to check the sexes.

I mean seriously, how hard is it understand? Surely everyone knows how babies are made. Male + female = babies. Animals, however intelligent they may be, do not know the concept of incest and see it as taboo. The main things that drive animals are the will to survive and to reproduce. Reproduce be it with their mother, father, son, daughter, cousin, whatever.

An accidental breeding is not having two chins together, letting them have a litter, claiming THAT one was an accident because "I didn't know any better", then showing up almost 111 days to the date later with yet another litter, stating "OMG, it was an accident, but I'm sooo glad they are healthy." Something fishy going on, no?

I was visiting another forum today and I saw this, from someone who is a member on CnH. Someone who repeatedly has these "accidents" of birth and other issues.

So, tell me, what do you think is an "accidental breeding?" Because I'm just not seeing as how leaving a male and a female together, even when you knew better, could possibly be construed as an accident.

Please, so the admins don't get upset, no names or obvious remarks. I'm just really curious as to how this happens.

 

[ABBY W.]

My first breeding was "accidental" because my chins were supposed to both be males. I was a newbie and didn't know any better. The breeder said they were males, so I figured they were males. Never made that mistake again.
I actually double and triple check my babies before they leave, just because I'm totally paranoid about it now.

The other situation you described where a male gets loose and ends up in a female's cage could be an accidental breeding, though kind of unlikely, I would think. I've had chins get loose before, but not then get into another chin's cage.

As far as I'm concerned though, if you leave a male and a female together and they have kits, that's not an accident, that's nature. And saying it was "an accident" is just ignorant. And letting it happen TWICE and claiming it's "an accident" is just plain dishonest.

 

[ticklechin]

I always like the ones that seem to always have pregnant rescues, again and again and again.

 

[RDZCRanch]

To me an accidental breeding is when you have escapees that breed or something along those lines. Or someone who was told that their male and female wouldn't breed.

Putting a male/female together, them having a baby and the owner saying the male/female are separated and more babies popping up in 111 days is NOT accidental.

I don't care if people breed, but stop lying about it or covering for it with "it was an accidental breeding!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! " Even five year olds I know understand that male+female=babies. It is not rocket science.

 

[jessers]

To me accidental breeding would be being a newbie and not knowing much and trusting what breeders and pet stores tell you. Ending up with two 'males' which isn't really two males in one cage. This is the ONLY reason that can possibly happen. I've never seen a chin whose able to pick two cage's locks

 

[chinchillalover0927]

so first off,
pebbles and duece were together then you all told me that they should be seperated...at the time i already knew she was pregnant so since they had been together since he was 8 weeks old i figured i would leave them together till she got close!!!! so since everyone think i left them together so they could breed again you are completely wrong so stop jumping to conclusions ok...

well as you all know pebbles sadly had a premature baby...with that being said when i came home i found the baby and seperated them THAT NIGHT!!!! they have never been together since then!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

i seperated them that nite to the fact that i DID NOT want them to breed back because i didnt want to breed her anymore because she did not have a pedigree!!!! and you all stated that she was not a good weight to even breed so i took you alls advice on that..like i said the only reason they were still together is i was trying to keep them together as long as i could cuz they had been together so long... i was NOT expecting pebbles to have a premature baby...so yes i admit that was MY Ignorance to try and leave them together till she got close because I DID NOT think that she would have a premature baby and maybe i should have thought about that..but im sorry for that.. i admit that was my fault but it was not intentional for them to breed AGAIN..

so if it was intentional then why did i seperate them that nite? why have they never been together again since then??? can you answer that...no you cant because it was accidental..you all jump to conclusions and loud cap people and run yalls mouths to try and make ANYONE look bad so that you all feel better about yourselves....

twf for example..you had no business loud capping me on the sugar glider central..that was NONE of your business and you could have handled it here or pm'd me about it..but instead you want to make me look bad...really? shows me how you trully are now....

i was a nervous wreck when i found out pebbles was pregnant again!!!!!!! i prayed everyday that her and the babies would be ok!!! fortunately she gave birth to 2 very healthy babies a standard female weighing 60 grams and a black velvet male weighing 55 grams...thats alllll i wished for was everyone to be healthy because i had NO "INTENTIONS" on breeding her again!!!! so before everyone goes around running there mouth about me please get your facts straight...

if it was intentional then why was he seperated from her the same night i found the premature baby.......can you answer that????

 

[kathiva]

To me it happened that I bought a female from a breeder and she had a surprise baby later on, and I asked the breeder if they had put her with a male in the past and they said no, so they don't know who the father is and that she maybe got pregnant through the cage bars or escaped one night, so I guess that was an accidental breeding then, but without knowing that she had become pregnant anyways, so of course the breeder never meant to breed her in the past, and I guess things like that can happen,

 

[RDZCRanch]

It was intentional because if you TRULY didn't want them to breedback you would have separated them the moment you thought she was pregnant. Males can breed their females BEFORE they give birth. You are a member of this forum and have been for some time, this is common knowledge given in the breeding section which you were more than happy to post to numerous times before. If I don't want a breedback, the male and female are separated the DAY I know the female is pregnant which is a.) when she gains a lot or b.) when I feel kits kicking.

If you want to breed, fine. You shouldn't lie about it. You lied to this forum and its members repeatedly and expect us to just take your word on anything you say now? Are you serious? Don't attack TWF just for pointing out to an ignorant forum that you lied and are not breeding responsibly. YOU stated that they were separated because you knew she was pregnant. Why is it NOW you are claiming he was only separated AFTER the baby was born? Stop lying and grow up.

 

[jessers]

i was a nervous wreck when i found out pebbles was pregnant again!!!!!!!

How did she get pregnant if they were seperated?

 

[threewingedfury]

twf for example..you had no business loud capping me on the sugar glider central..that was NONE of your business and you could have handled it here or pm'd me about it..but instead you want to make me look bad...really? shows me how you trully are now....

Yes, I had the right to say it. It was not to make you look bad, it was simply to educate the community that you're lying to. Anything you put on a forum is public, and it becomes my business when I'm being lied to. Hence why you didn't post it on this forum. You mentioned in the other thread that the chins were separated before you had the first baby. That you didn't know any better. Well, it looks like you didn't care after all. It shows how I truly am - I'm a responsible breeder who cares.

 

[tunes]

Chinchillalover - First, !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! this sucks. Stop doing it or I'll start deleting your posts. It's annoying and I'm not going to look at it again.

Second, I doubt anybody had any clue any of this was about you, but you certainly made it loud and clear now. If you had nothing to lie about or hide, why bother to post at all? You should have just gone on your way and ignored it.

Third, I have no idea what "loud capping" means. I assume it's some bizarre teenaged slang that mature adults don't use? Does this mean calling you out?

I'm not going to go back and look, but I seem to recall your thread about the first pregnancy. I believe you said you removed the male as soon as you found out the female was pregnant. That would have been before she delivered. So how did this breedback occur? If she was already separated from the male, it couldn't have.

 

[chinchillalover0927]

Chinchillalover - First, !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! this sucks. Stop doing it or I'll start deleting your posts. It's annoying and I'm not going to look at it again.

Second, I doubt anybody had any clue any of this was about you, but you certainly made it loud and clear now. If you had nothing to lie about or hide, why bother to post at all? You should have just gone on your way and ignored it.

Third, I have no idea what "loud capping" means. I assume it's some bizarre teenaged slang that mature adults don't use? Does this mean calling you out?

I'm not going to go back and look, but I seem to recall your thread about the first pregnancy. I believe you said you removed the male as soon as you found out the female was pregnant. That would have been before she delivered. So how did this breedback occur? If she was already separated from the male, it couldn't have.

because i felt bad to remove him from her if i didnt have to at the time! and omg i surely couldnt have told yall that because yall would have flipped out if i had told you that...i cant be honest with anyone on here because yall are crazy sometimes and take things a little to far! and yea i dont appreciate being talked about especially when multiple people know who is being talked about, i was going to just walk away and leave it alone but the reason i didnt is because you all are saying i purposely wanted them to breed again and i didnt...if i really wanted them to breed again i would just tell yall i did and tell yall im going to breed if i want to breed.. but i have everyone is seperated all males and females! i havent had a male and female together since pebbles had her premature baby..lexi and onix got seperated because i didnt think she was pregnant at all so i prevented it from happening..why did i seperate them if i intentionally wanted to keep breeding????? all yall worry about is what WAS said...im telling yall what is going on rite here , rite now!! I HAVE NO INTENTIONS ON BREEDING AND HAVENT SINCE PEBBLES HAD THAT FIRST BABY!

 

[Peep_erz]

Honestly, sorry to say this but yes people are that stupid to think that "I don't want to breed and I'll watch them and as long as I separate them while they are trying to mate nothing will happen." I've had a Biology grad student go through a dissection training and ask "how can you tell if the rat is male or female?"

I know of grown women who "wish" they won't get pregnant and use other methods of protection that aren't proper birth control. Their pregnancies are also called "accidents".

Yes these people are ignorant. No they don't understand nature or biology or how babies are made. If they don't even understand it for themselves they aren't going to understand breeding (or not breeding actually) for chinchillas or any other pets.

 

[RDZCRanch]

Do you know what the definition of hoarding is? You might find your name in there...

im sitting here saying it WAS an accidental breeding but they refuse to believe me, the only reason the male was left with her was because she was pregnant and i was going to remove him when she got close to prevent a breed back but instead she had a premature baby , which i didnt think about happening and he bred her back..i have no other males with any other females currently and i even seperated my other breeding pair because i was preventing pregnancy with the other female...so i do feel it was not rite for her to do that...because then everyone thinks im just a liar and it makes me look bad...my sugar gliders are in same sex cages..icee is by herself and my males are together..i have no intentions on breeding them!

We don't believe you because you have lied to us numerous times and once again you are caught. You are just NOW calling this stillborn baby premature. You didn't know when they had bred so you can't possibly have known her due date. You KNEW she was pregnant and left them together KNOWING the male can breed her the moment she delivers or even before she gives birth. THIS IS INTENTIONAL! To cover your tracks you're now trying to say the baby was premature. I saw the pictures of that baby. It was stillborn...that doesn't make it premature. She looked fully developed, but dead. So once again, stop lying to cover your tracks. Grow up and don't get angry at people for calling you out on your lies.

 

[chinchillalover0927]

so here it goes ok,

im sorry for getting defensive and worked up but i ask that you all please stop calling me a liar...yes i lied about taking duece out when i found out pebbles was pregnant because i felt bad to take them apart if she was already pregnant...
truthfully i had full intentions on seperating them before she had the baby so breedback wouldnt occur..
yes it was MY ignorance to leave them together because i was to dumb to think about her having a premature baby and going into labor early so yes it is MY FAULT that she got pregnant again but i ask that you all understand it was not intentionally done...or i wouldnt have seperated them the minute i found the dead baby...
i did seperate onix and lexi when i said i did because i wasnt sure if she was pregnant or not and im happy to say that she IS NOT pregnant..
so i ask that you please all take a minute to read this and stop accusing me of being an intentional breeder...i did not want to risk pebbles life after what happened so why would i have bred her again on purpose? i didnt, because i love my baby girl and i was so upset when i found out she was pregnant again..alli care about now is she had to healthy babies...
so i apologize about my attitude and me getting upset... im sorry

AND i am not lying about the baby, i thought in the thread no one really knew if it was stillborn or premature so i thought it was both...sorry for the misunderstanding but its not a lie...thats what i have been thinking this entire time..

 

[RDZCRanch]

So now you're suddenly admitting you lied...but you aren't a liar. Misrepresenting facts is lying, Sweetheart.

 

[chinchillalover0927]

im admitting that i lied about seperating them so please stop being rude..i have stopped being rude and apologized to everyone i got snappy with...
all i ask is you all understand i didnt intentionally mean for the breeding to happen again, that happened because i was to stupid to think about other things that could occur, like her having the baby early..(which i thought she was a premature baby like i stated above)... so yes its my fault the breedback occured and yes i lied about seperating them..but like i said i removed him from her the night i found that baby and he has since been living with my other boys..

 

[Laurie]

FIRST OF ALL AND LAST OF ALL PREGNANCY IS NOT AN ACCIDENT IT IS A MIRACLE! Period, I don't care what anyone says in animals or humans it is a miracle, the gift of life is a miracle. And again in both humans and animals WHENEVER the penis is introduced to the vagina pregnancy can occur. So if your chin escapes and breeds it's not an accident if you have males and females in the same area--females can't breed with females--males can't breed with males. If you only had males or only had females, pregnancy would never occur. What you might have is an unplanned pregnancy--like escaped chins, or when you don't know the sex of your chin and put opposite sex chins together, or you purchase a chin from someone who didn't know better and sold you a pregnant chin; or you are foolish human who follows the rhthym method or who foolishly thinks the pill works when you're on antibotics, or you had unsafe sex--not an accident but unplanned as you weren't smart enough to stop it from happening in the first place. I think people like to say "accident" because we all live under the "oh well accidents happen" umbrella. But it's not an accident at all IMO, it's something unplanned and if you were prepared in the first place it would not happen.

 

[chinchillalover0927]

it all happened due to my ignorance...i should have seperated them before but i chose not to out of my stupidity..yes birth is a miracle but it still shouldnt have happened..i didnt want to risk loosing pebbles life over it.

 

[Ash]

I think saying that saying an escaped male or missexed chins aren't an accident is a bit unfair. No one intends for their chins to get out, and every chinchilla owner knows that, no matter how prepared you are, it's not a matter of "if" it's a matter of "when". Also, someone getting two mis-sexed chins didn't intend to get them mis-sexed, and therefore it's not poor planning in their part, and it is indeed an accidental pregnancy. People with mis-sexed chins usually had no intention of having a male/female pair.

Also, saying it's an "unplanned" pregnancy seems to imply that it may have been intended at a later date, just not at that time, which usually isn't the case.