Rancher/Breeder Barn/Shed/Room

[ChinHeart]

Wow, that's an interesting title. Hahahaha :laughitup:

I used to be a member of the Wisconsin MCBA chapter, but then moved from Wisconsin to Colorado a few years ago. Just prior to doing so I sold my herd. Now that I'm reasonably stable in our new home in Colorado I've been looking to get back into breeding for show chins. I'm taking my time with this, am only in planning stages.

I'm not talking about your average chin pet owner with half a dozen chins. I'm hoping to hear form breeders/ranchers with a professional set-up that's cohesive and organized that works best for them.

Ordinarily I would call up ranchers or large breeders and beg a tour of their facilities or try to politely pick their brains for ideas. But I live out east of denver in the middle of nowhere and thought it more prudent to ask those of you here for information and pictures for the time being.

I'm researching the barn/shed/rooms/facility of larger breeders and ranchers. I'm talking actual setups, brands of cages used, water systems vs. water bottles, any pictures would be PHENOMENAL. Set ups for air intake/flow and air conditioning/heating elements, cleaning procedures, etc. You name it. Do you have all one type of cage - breeding runs, or do you have a breeding run style in addition to a larger style for small colonies of kits vs. colony breeding cages vs....? Do you keep the breeders and growers seperately? Do you have a chin ward for quarantined or ill chins, babies being hand fed? If so what is the flow of your layout (as an example - enter into the growers area, follow through to the breeders, through a door at the end into the quarantine ward? totally seperate buildings?)? Would you recommend a facility built underground in order to mediate temperatures in summer or winter, or rather depend on mechanical temperature maintenance? Do you have a seperate facility for wood working or cage making?

I thought it would be better to lay down what I want from the start and build from there. In leiu of random cages put where I can fit them I'd rather have an orderly well thought out setup instead. I've seen a thread that asked "if you won the lottery..what would you build?" Instead I ask, if you could start over from scratch on a regular income what would you do differently?

On a british chinchilla forum I frequent they often speak of their chinchilla sheds. They seem akin to our chinchilla barns. Smallest recommended size being 12x8, with at least 7 ft. ceilings. Insulations, electric/water, heating, etc. It seems fairly common to hear about temperature in the sheds on the forum being just above freezing in winter, any thoughts on that in addition to descriptions on how you heat your own barn?

I would love to hear from their american counterparts with small to large herds their opinions. What would you recommend, a barn or a room in your home? What's the minimal size you'd recommend, things you MUST have (show lights, sink, floor drain, cement floors, etc)? Dimensions?

Building from scratch - what are the MOST IMPORTANT elements in a chin room/barn/shed to incorporate or think about?

Thank you all in advance for your time and input. I realize my thoughts are all over the place but hope that you can catch the jist of my questions.

 

[tunes]

I converted an oversized 1 car garage. It had dirt floors, 2 x 4 on the inside walls, and open to the rafters. We insulated it (too much), dry walled it, and put in a wood floor. We were going to do cement, but I worried about babies falling or getting dropped, and felt the wood floor had more give to it. We put rolled plastic stuff under the floor to block moisture.

We way over insulated and I had huge problems with humidity. It was so bad, that last year I rarely had to run the heater, or run it higher than low. That finally got resolved this past fall, when I had a squirrel cage installed. I haven't had to run a dehumidifier, but I do have to run a heater now, which is fine.

I wish my ceilings were taller. By the time we installed the floor, it brought it up a good 10 inches, which means when we closed off the upper part of the garage, my ceiling is much lower than I would like it. It's okay, I don't smack my head or anything, it just feels small to me (I'm 6 foot tall). I had two good sized windows installed in the one end, and the squirrel cage in the other, so when I run the air or open a window, it creates a really nice air flow. I have an entry way where I store stuff (feed, hay, dust) and a second door to the inside of the barn. We did that in case of escapees and it's really been a good thing lately.

Half of my cages are Ryerson runs, half are wire cages. If I had it to do all over again, they would all be wire cages. I do not like the Ryerson runs. They are well built and they last forever, but they dark and cave like. I like that my wire cages have lots of light in them and have really good air flow. I don't like the place I got my wire cages from, and I am hoping to re-do them all myself the way I want them. But, I do like the general shape and size of the wire cages.

I use water bottles, and will most likely always use water bottles. I like that I can sterilize them and their tops. I like that I can see at a glance who has water and who doesn't, who is drinking and who isn't, etc.

So, if I had to start from scratch, with gotta haves rather than wish I could haves:

1) Two car garage in size, so I could have more storage. Keep in mind though, I'm sure like with anybody else, the more room you have, the more chins you will stuff in there.
2) No chins in the house, unless they are sick or for quarantine. I'm tired of shavings everywhere and the dust everywhere on dusting days sucks. Thankfully, I only have a small part of the herd in the house, but even so, it's a pain.
3) Wood floors with linoleum, not tile. Tile was a mistake. Too many cracks when water spills. Linoleum would be better and I wanted something I could mop if need be.
4) Windows on both ends of the barn, even if it was one on each. A/C in one window, opposite end would have the squirrel cage.
5) More outlets. I only have two, one on each end of the barn. It's a pain. They would also most likely be on the ceiling or high up on the wall. Chewed cords are also a pain.
6) Less insulation. We overinsulated thinking to save on heat and instead it's just been a mess.
7) A sink area with a dishwasher IN the barn. It is a huge, huge pain in the butt to carry 100s of bottles back and forth to the house for washing. I'll do it, but I don't like it.
8) A corner of the barn with show lights.
9) All wire cages, but I would make the bottoms where the trays go out of something solid something. It's a pain when the tray constantly catches on the wire.
10) A heat source with a thermostat. My building is small and I use a space heater. I constantly run out all during the day and night, in a panic in case the temperature drops or goes too high. I would install a small wall propane furnace with a thermostat.

That's all I can think of off the top of my head, but I'm sure I'll come up with more later.

 

[RDZCRanch]

Wow...that is a LOT of information to pack into a post, lol. I'll try to condense as much as possible and I'll see if I can get pictures later. My setup is temporary but it works very well for me until I get my permanent building up. When we get the plans for my chin building made up I can email them to you as well. Probably won't be for a few months though. We have to get permits for buildings out here.

Anyhow, I have about 56 chinchillas right now and am going to expand to 100 breeders in the next couple years. I use mostly runs with a couple of colony cages and then I have my growing cages.

I use water bottles. I don't have to worry about clogged valves and I can physically see each chinchilla's water intake and I will always use water bottles. They're also easier to clean.

I don't deal with heating because it doesn't snow where I am. I have a a/c unit mounted in the window and a small fan that points outward to circulate the air.

As far as cleaning. With multiple chinchillas I won't scrub every pan or cage down once a week or even once a month. If the chins possibly look unhealthy or if the cage is particularly nasty I'll switch it with a spare pan and scrub the heck out of it. Otherwise, I scrape the pans clean once a week and put in new shavings. As long as it's kept up on weekly and there's no sick chins with diarrhea the pans don't get disgusting.

For a chin building those are fairly good outlines for dimensions. 7ft high and no smaller than 8 by 12. I plan on making mine closer to 10 by 12 or 10 by 16. The space in the building gets taken up very quickly. I'm also going to put up a small storage shed next to the building to hold all the shavings, food, and other supplies so that they aren't taking up room in the chin building.

 

[ChinHeart]

Half of my cages are Ryerson runs, half are wire cages. If I had it to do all over again, they would all be wire cages. I do not like the Ryerson runs. They are well built and they last forever, but they dark and cave like. I like that my wire cages have lots of light in them and have really good air flow. I don't like the place I got my wire cages from, and I am hoping to re-do them all myself the way I want them. But, I do like the general shape and size of the wire cages.

Peggy, thank you for the response. Very useful and a lot to think about. Mind me asking, what general shape and size specifically were you thinking for the wire cages? One uniform cage for all chins? Different cages for mothers w/ kits vs. growing chins? Thanks.

 

[ChinHeart]

I use water bottles. I don't have to worry about clogged valves and I can physically see each chinchilla's water intake and I will always use water bottles. They're also easier to clean.

Would love to see an email with the plans for your permanent building hun. Thank you for that! It sounds like the water bottles are a great idea. The ability to monitor each cages water intake is invaluable and something I hadn't thought of. One of those seeing the trees for the forest moments. Thank you both for that recommendation.

So far it seems as if everyone is in one area in both of your barns. Given the opportunity would you seperate out the chins (breeders vs. growers) or just dont see the need for it? Has anyone set up a chin clinic in their barns? An area designated for sick/premature chins and their care?

For those of you with the need to heat your barns, what about the idea of radiant heating in your flooring? From my experience it seems easier to maintain a comfortable environment with lesser expense using radiant heat. Just a thought. I read the descriptions of their air flow set up at the Shoot's website and they described something similar Peggy. Two air inlets at the opposite ends of the room. One high and one low. Reversing the air flow depending on seasons. I'd love to hear if someone has a design or ideas on how to optimize that.

Thanks again!

These are all fantastic answers and I thank you both sincerely for your input.

 

[RDZCRanch]

Sick chins or babies that need monitored come in the house in a special set of larger growing cages for 24 hour surveillance. I plan on having a room or some area where I will have show lights for a grading table and that can double as a monitoring area.

I wouldn't separate my growers from my breeders. My growers start where the breeders are and 90% of them end up where the breeders are so to move them during the growing period to me is counter-productive.

 

[tunes]

Growers and breeders in the same building. Sick, quarantine in the house. Right now I have someone else's herd in the house here, at first for quarantine, and now because I have no more room for that many animals in the barn.

As far as cages, I would go 18-20 high, 24 deep, and 18-20 wide for a pair, possibly a trio, and for weaning cages. I also breed in colonies. They would be the same height and depth, but at least 24 wide, and probably connected to another cage by a jump hole in between (not behind) like I have now with some of my cages, that way they will actually have 48 inches wide for a colony. I don't use jumps, I don't use collars. I don't like them. I prefer to pair, trio, or colony breed and move the male around as needed. I'm just not a fan of breeding collars and I never will be. I have Ryerson runs for trios and quads, but I would open the jump covers and let them go from side to side.

I don't want huge cages that I have to worry about chins getting hurt, babies getting leapt on or falling from high shelves, etc. I am primarily a breeding barn, so my cages reflect that. I do want them to have fun "stuff" though. I provide wood houses for all my cages, and with the larger cages (when I have all larger cages) I will give them a leap 'n ledge or corner shelf or two, and for the weaning cages, hammocks.

 

[Godins Chinchillas]

All of my chins are in my basement. Right now I have 16 female breeders and 5 breeder males. I have roughly 14 growers. I do expect I will be expanding the breeders more with my upcoming growers but right now it is working well. My room is roughly 12 x 20. There is a sink in there.

There are no windows so lighting is provided by full spectrum 14 hours a day. It's on a timer. Comes on at 6:30 am and shuts off at 8:30 pm. There is an exhaust system in the room leading to the outdoors and on the other side of the basement that is not closed off where the chins are the windows are open 24 hrs a day. The basement (unless there is a storm) is dry and surprising not stale smelling in the very least.

I use water bottles-and although I hate carting them upstairs to wash as the sink down stairs is just big enough to empty and fill and only has cold water, I wouldn't change that. I had a watering system and I did like it until either the lines got chewed or leaked and made a huge mess. The floors are cement. Temperature is pretty much controlled since it is downstairs.

Growers are with breeders just on opposite walls. I have 3 ryerson type runs and the rest are wire cages with the chins sitting on shavings. I am currently working on building my own cages.

Quaratine/sick animals are kept upstairs.

The reason why I have them in the basement is because hubby is very allergic to their environment and dust. He hates it when I have them upstairs. We hope to move to a new house within 5 yrs. When we do move-we will be looking for a barn or build one.

Jessica

 

[Lynn & The Chins]

Chinheart, I look forward to meeting you at the National show this weekend in OKC.

As a member of ECBC, I will be happy to introduce you to some GREAT Colorado Ranchers/Breeders and I invite you to attend our next meeting on March 20th.I'll get you the details...

 

[ChinHeart]

That sounds fantastic Lynn, thank you very much. Seems like building your own cages is a theme. And the Ryersons, the Shoots, etc. have done it as well. I looked into the cost of the galvanized wire from Cage Works, Bass Equipement and Klubertantz. The shipping is a little prohibitive. But then if you're building enough cages to kit out a barn I suppose its economic. Thanks for the input Jessica. I love to hear the variety between everyone's setups. The sky is the limit if you have an imagination.

 

[Spoof]

Instead I ask, if you could start over from scratch on a regular income what would you do differently?

I got the chance to do this. )

I now have uniform cages. Due to cost and not seeing anything I liked I built them myself. I have 32 holes and one community grower cage in the barn. Ideally I'd like to have two separate rooms, one for growers, one for breeders, ideally, I'd not live in the state of Louisiana when that comes about.

I specifically bought a property with a heated/cooled 12 x 11 room outside of my house. No more chins in the house.

I had planned on having more but due to the cost of keeping chins in the south I've had to cap my breeders at 8. I can't keep the room dry or cool enough with more than 30 chins and no venting. Health reasons too.

Venting is extremely important, the largest herds have open air cooling and lots of venting/air movement. It's critical to their health.

I love my watering system, it is the awesome. It comes down to time and it takes considerably less time to maintain a watering system. They let you know when one isn't working.

I have large feeders/water reservoirs and can leave my herd with minimal care up to a week. Eg, my neighbor can come (literally) just look in on them. Much easier than having to hire or arrange for someone who knows what they are doing.

I 100% recommend having a floor with a drain.
Painted the walls with waterproof paint.
Ceiling Fan!
Timer controlled lighting with no windows.
Thermostat controlled cooling.
No pans, I use a shopvac. Ronda did it with 800 chins, granted she had one that held a normal garbage can as the tank.
Biggest lesson learned from the early days - don't overcrowd and always have twice as many holding cages as you have breeders.
Support system - find people early on who will care for your herd in your absence, particularly if you get hurt. Few people can take on 10 chins at once let alone a few hundred.
Take it slow! )