Horse suggestions?

[Riven]

Some may remember that later last summer we took in a horse, Julie.

She was a bit thin, we put her on senior feed, had her feet done, and her teeth done, she was sensitive on one side, but the vet did the best should could without sedation ( because we were a little worried about her weight and sedation).

Winter set in, and I really have only myself to blame, but she lost more weight before I realized it. She's not what I'd consider excessively under-weight.

She is 24 yrs old, so not what I consider an "OLD" horse, but is up there in years. From watching her eat, I think she has a bad tooth perhaps? She is in the pen by herself now, with free access to grass hay, and I've been giving her a 2 gallon bucket of alfalfa pellet/ beet pulp pellet mix, soaked in water ( it's about 2 gallons after being soaked) with a scoop of feed in the morning and evening, as well as a scoop of supplement, yes chin supplement, about noon. ( barley, flax, sunflower seeds, manna, bran, etc ).

I'm hoping to pack enough weight on to get her mouth looked at.

She is also blanketed as the weather is bad and I figure she needs all the help she can get, and if it helps keep her warmth in good. It is not a winter blanket, it's a medium weight blanket.

Any suggestions at all? My mom thinks I should put her down, my husband thinks we can get her through... She has been wormed on schedule since I've gotten her.

One other concern I have/had was her urine seems very orange, but I did read that this is common in the snow due to basically oxidation. I saw her peeing the other day and it was dark coming out, but not as dark as it looks in the snow.

She has free access to clean water out of a tank with a heater, so it's never frozen over.

Any thing?

 

[Snickers]

I would keep her. Have you tried alfalfa molasses?

 

[minrex]

You can give a horse oil (like corn oil) as a source of fat. It adds pure calories to the diet and it's safe for horses. Studies have shown that a horse can safely be given up to 6 cups of oil per day. I have a 30 year old gelding to whom I've had to give oil in the winter.

Also, you definitely need to get her teeth looked at and treated if there's a problem. I don't see how the perceived risk of sedating her can outweigh the risk to her health and quality of life if her mouth constantly hurts and she can't eat because of her teeth. Not to mention the fact that trying to do a horse's teeth without some form of sedation is incredibly dangerous. I knew a horse that flipped over and died from knocking its head when the vet attempted to float its teeth without sedation. Even WITH sedation, my old boy attempted to pull back and "get away" when he had his teeth done this past summer. Without sedation he would have been completely impossible to deal with. With a quiet horse you can probably manage a real light tooth filing without sedation, but if the poor mare has a real tooth problem that needs attention, it's probably going to require more than a light, manual filing, and is therefore going to require sedation.

Depending on how much senior feed she's already getting, you could try increasing that some, and you might also try switching from grass hay to something with a little more energy, like alfalfa.

In the end, it comes down to her teeth. Long-fiber forage such as hay provides a horse with more heat producing energy than grain, and if a horse has trouble eating hay, or doesn't have access to hay, it's going to have a hard time keeping weight on in the winter. A horse that is given constant access to a high-quality hay but little or no grain is going to be able to keep its weight better in the winter than a horse that is given as much grain as it can safely eat but limited hay. The mare may have constant access to hay, but if her teeth are hurting, she's limited in how much of it she can eat. If the problem really is her teeth, fixing that should drastically help her weight issues.

 

[Show-MeChins]

i have one thing to say about the teeth situation... when selecting an "equine dentist" find one that is actually a "dentist", all the vets around here claim to be able to do it... but i only see a good result when using a real "equine dentist" we get all our horses teeth done every 8-12 months, she uses the air tools, it generally takes her about an hour per horse and she charges $85 per horse.... she removes the caps that i know my vet doesnt do (says they will loose them when they loose them, but what if theres a problem you cant deal with bc the cap..?) which i guess with an older horse, that really wouldnt be much of a problem...

Try a better hay then just grass (IF its really JUST a cheap grass) i dont like timothy for my horses... i LOVE brome, but am currently feeding orchard grass/alfafa

ETA- i was working on a well known breeding facility here, and was told to feed this one mare 2 cans (large coffee can) of sr morning noon and night (told by owner) and then i asked the vet if that was ok...bc with sweet feed, that is too much (IMO) and i was then told that the sr. doesnt do a whole lot, and if you wanted a horse to gain a good amount of weight, Equine Sr. was not the way to do it... now i know that a lot of vets recommend it, but with knowing this... i wouldnt use it to actually try to put weight on a horse,.... its just eaisier to digest... as it kinda melts

 

[minrex]

I was going to edit my above post, but ran out of time. I wanted to note that, last winter, my old horse (who was 28-29 at the time) lost about 100 pounds over the course of the winter, despite the fact that I was pumping him full of senior feed, mushed up alfalfa cubes and supplementing his feed with oil. Over the course of this winter he's actually gained weight, and the only difference between last winter and this is that I'm giving him about twice as much alfalfa hay (last winter he had free-choice grass hay and was getting about 15 pounds of alfalfa a day, whereas this winter he's getting about 30 pounds per day), and I had his teeth done over the summer, which has helped immensely. I am actually not giving him any oil or mushed up alfalfa cubes this winter, and the amount of senior feed I'm giving him has not changed since last winter. The increased amount of actual, higher-energy HAY and his recently "fixed" teeth are the reason that he's a big fatty this winter.

 

[starleomach]

Glycosamine wich is in Max Flex, does wonders with old guys..we have a 30 year old here.

 

[Riven]

I don't see how the perceived risk of sedating her can outweigh the risk to her health

When sedation is possibly ( beyond the normal chance that always exists) going to end up in death, I consider that a very big risk... At this point to sedate her, her body probably can't handle it. She eats... she actually eats most of the time, she just eats very slowly. As for previously, I don't know why the vet made that recommendation, she was thin, but I didn't feel to the point that the vet did of endangering her with sedation. I have talked with another vet since.

She is getting oil in her mash as well, I forgot to add that.

The hay is "prairie hay", a mix of brome and other wild grasses, we don't have timothy around here.

If it was possible to have her sedated right now without a higher risk of her not recovering from it, than her coming out ahead, I would totally do that, but right now, I need to get more weight on her before we can reach that point.

She is currently getting a mix of senior ( because it's softer to eat) and sweet feed.

Right now the amount of her intake is appx. like this: ( might be a little off, since she free feeds hay I don't get an actual measure on it)
alfalfa
beet pulp
prairie hay
sweet feed
senior feed
supplement mix

I'd be a little nervous on replacing the hay with alfalfa simply because of the difference it would make with so much more protein, and less fiber.

Have you tried alfalfa molasses

I'm not sure what this is actually, but will definitely google it.

ETA: that's kind of what I'm doing right now, she doesn't like the beet pulp so I add some molasses to sweeten it, not a lot though. I wonder how much is in that?

 

[addictedtochins]

We have a Hostess Bakery Outlet store in the main town around here and they sell those big like 6 ft. bakers rack of "pet feed" really cheaply. It was about $5. It consists of mostly bread (you can always request mostly bread) and the horses loved it. It was a good low cost high calorie extra. We got it in the freezing winter months when it would just stay frozen out in the garage. We would bring in the amount we wanted to thaw before we fed it. Snyder's Bakery also had this. Check your yellow pages for your area.

 

[xBetterBeSocialx]

I agree with the other posters...your problem is probably with her teeth. If you need to put weight on so you can sedate her, corn oil works great. One of my best friends had a horse who was very skinny and within a few months, she had put on a lot of weight thanks in part to the corn oil. If that doesn't work, there are several products out there that put weight on as well. There's one called Weight Builder (I think)...my horse was on it for a while after he coliced badly and he gained all his weight right back.

If you're wanting to give her a joint supplement to help her move around easier, I highly recommend Majesty Flex Wafers. The have glucosamine, chondroitin, and MSM in them and they're in cookie form so you're sure she's getting it all. My 23 year old horse Taz is on them and they literally saved his life. He has bad arthritis in his hocks and wasn't responding to any other supplements. We tried them as a last effort before putting him down and within a month or so, he was bouncing around like he was a baby again.

The last thing I want to mention is that all horses reach their lifespan at different times. We have a horse at work who is 35 and still being a brat in lessons, but we also lost a horse at 14 last year. Have the vet check her out really well and then make the decision that's best for the horse. If she's healthy other than her teeth, then go for it! She probably has many good years ahead of her. If the vet finds some substantial problems, it might be time to say good bye. But it doesn't sound like she's there yet...keep working with her!

Best of luck!! :-D

 

[Riven]

This last fall when I rode her she sure didn't seem like she was "old" at all, lol.

I'll look into those wafers, I think the local supply store has them!

I'm going to talk to another vet tomorrow as well to see if they would be comfortable sedating her or not.

Today I took her blanket off as it's warm out, and it appears that she is gaining some weight, especially in her rib cage area.

 

[pricklesnquills]

I would say, start giving her alfalfa and a little more senior feed. I rescued a horse very much like yours last year. She's about the same age and needed a lot of the same work done. And she was under weight. Not severely underweight, but she definitely was a good bit underweight. Our vet sedated her to float her teeth with out thinking twice about it. Sissy(the horse) did great! I think that a horse's teeth and hoof health are the two most crucial things. I would definitely be proactive with getting her teeth done.

Also, if she's having tooth problems, that could be why she's having trouble putting weight on. She could be dropping food when she eats. I'm not sure, but it's just a thought

 

[Riven]

Her feet are good, my SIL does them, lol.

I feed her in a large tote, so that what she drops goes back in there so she can eat it again.

Took the cat in for a neuter this morning, and they didn't have a promising look on their face, but they said they would sedate her. So she has an appt. at 10:00 on Friday.

Wish us luck!